Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 Print
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required! (Read 12637 times)
 
athawk11
YaBB Administrator
Owner Member 2012
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


1949 CJ3A

Posts: 2771
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Joined: 01/26/11
Gender: Male
3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
06/10/13 at 20:51:47
Print Post  
This is a puzzle.

If you had a tub, but there is “Some Assembly Required”, and you have no instruction manual describing step A, B, C, etc…, what order would you assemble them in? 

Keep in mind that you are plug welding the parts together and some areas may be more difficult or impossible to assemble if you don’t get the order right.

Parts included in your kit…

Cargo floor (1)
Wheel house-Driver and Passenger side
Wheel house support and spare tire mount support- Passenger side (1)
Wheel house support Driver side   
Rear quarter panel- Driver and Passenger side
Floor riser  (from front floor pans to rear floor)(1)
Rear light panel-Driver and Passenger side
Rear valance  (below the tailgate) (1)
Rear Tailgate surround with chain catches (1)
Front floor pans-Driver and Passenger side
Front hat channel support kit for front floor pans

The cowl, dash, firewall, transmission hump, and front panels with small step have been pre-assembled for you.

Tim
  

2-1949 CJ3A 
1-1946 CJ2A
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
NoCoWillys
3A Lover
**
Offline


Still Plays With Jeeps

Posts: 87
Location: Strasburg, CO
Joined: 06/18/12
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #1 - 06/11/13 at 00:37:15
Print Post  
This is how I'd do it... may not be right but after all the hacking and reassembling I had to do on my tub...

1 Cargo floor (1)
2 Floor riser  (from front floor pans to rear floor)(1)
3 Front floor pans-Driver and Passenger side

4/5 Assemble these as individual units then attach to each side.
Wheel house-Driver and Passenger side
Wheel house support and spare tire mount support- Passenger side (1)
Wheel house support Driver side   
Rear quarter panel- Driver and Passenger side

6/7/8 For the rear I attached the right and left panels to the rear valance, then attached it as a unit to the rest of the body.  I used a cheap harbor freight 110v spot welder and it held up through that job.  Then it died and I returned it.  Got cash back because they were out of stock.  Said I could wait until the got the next shipment in the next day, or could just take a refund.
Rear light panel-Driver and Passenger side
Rear valance  (below the tailgate) (1)

9 Rear Tailgate surround with chain catches (1)

10 Front hat channel support kit for front floor pans
The hat channels are a little tricky.  I didn't have the stamps on my floor pan to indicate where to place the channels.  Instead I placed the entire body back on the frame on top of the lose hat channel (only replaced one side) and moved things around until it lined up as best it could. I then outlined everything with a sharpy. Pulled the body back off and welded away.
  

'53 CJ3a
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
athawk11
YaBB Administrator
Owner Member 2012
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


1949 CJ3A

Posts: 2771
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Joined: 01/26/11
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #2 - 06/11/13 at 14:44:06
Print Post  
NoCo,
Excellent!  As you may suspect, I am at this stage in tub re-assembly and wanted to read what others may have done.

I wish there was an old Willys Overland assembly line video showing the process that was used.  That would be neat to see.   

My initial plan mimics yours fairly closely, but with some changes in the tail light panel and valance.  You've given me some additional things to consider.  When I get it together, I'll post the 'goods, bads, and uglies'. Smiley...  Sad ... Angry...
Thanks for the imput. 

Tim
  

2-1949 CJ3A 
1-1946 CJ2A
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
F Bill
Flatfender Master
*****
Offline



Posts: 1395
Location: ????
Joined: 12/02/10
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #3 - 06/11/13 at 22:16:10
Print Post  
William over on the G 503 board built a tub from pieces, basically. If you check the tub rebuilding thread you'll see a link to his thread.

IMHO the way to do it...

Rear floor first.
Add floor riser.
Assemble each wheelhouse
Spot weld each wheelhouse to floor
Assemble rear valance, tail light panels, then tailgate surround.
Weld that to the jeep.
Weld each quarter panel to jeep.

Then in your case, join the two halves, Add the individual floor pans next, hat channels last.

Use your frame as an assembly jig. Use clecos or sheet metal screws to temporarily hold panels to check fit.

Assemble it completely to check fit, then dismantle and start over with your spot welder.


When I actually do a tub I am sure my opinion of the correct order will change. Cheesy
  

Owner of the world famous?? Pintojeep 3A and one yet to be named stock project 3A.
Based in central TX and upstate NY.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
1955CJ-5
Flatfender Master
2013 Sponsor Member
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


It wasn't always green....

Posts: 2338
Location: Boise, idaho
Joined: 12/18/12
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #4 - 06/12/13 at 00:01:41
Print Post  
This is a really interesting problem and I have thought about it several times while working on my 3a.

First you need to keep everything square, so if it's available use the frame as a building fixture.

I would build back from the dash/cowl as you want it to be straight and square with the frame.

Another difficulty is the "layering" back at the tailgate surround. The wheelbox side goes against the surround, and the tail light panel layers against it. Access is very limited back there if the sides are on. (mine were mostly rusted out so some access was provided!)

So, I would...

Buy a bunch of clamps, and clekos...

Attach the cowl/dash transmission tunnel to the frame. Remember that the hat channel goes between the frame and the floorboard gussett, so allow for that...

Attach the riser and valance to the frame. Square everything up..

Rear floor is next..

You could at this point add the hats and floors, once again using the frame mounts to align everything. The floors run under the riser to the rear edge of the riser lip

Then the tailgate surround


Based on what I saw when taking my 3a apart, the spare tire support/baffle must have been attached to the side and then to the wheelhouse. The welds on the wheelhouse holding the baffle appeared to be made from the top of the wheelhouse and were not spot welds..this is a tricky area! I was successful in adding the baffle after the side was on but it was tough to reach in there and weld...the curved support butts against the seam between the tail light panel and side. Perhaps the factory installed the curved support before the baffle was installed..mine came as an assembled unit...judgment required here!!

So, that being said, I'd:

Attach the wheelhouses including the rear support on the drivers side to the rear floor, riser and tail gate surround.

Add the tail light panels. These too bolt to the frame to help alignment.

Hat's, and floors, if not already done

Then the sides.

As Bill said, if it can all be assembled prior to welding to check fit that would be the way to go.

Will you be using pre-made panels or will you be making your own?

The pre-made panels are sized for you and I found them to be an excellent fit.....But if you have examples to build/form from that would work fine also..

There are about a thousand things that are left unsaid here..but you will figure it out..

Keep us informed!

Randy


« Last Edit: 06/12/13 at 00:13:26 by 1955CJ-5 »  

1955 CJ-5, A friend for 55 years....1951 CJ-3A, a new addition. 1929 Model A Ford Closed Cab Pickup...
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
1955CJ-5
Flatfender Master
2013 Sponsor Member
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


It wasn't always green....

Posts: 2338
Location: Boise, idaho
Joined: 12/18/12
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #5 - 06/12/13 at 13:26:25
Print Post  
So I have been thinking about this some more....

One of the big issues that I see is having the sides fit after all this sub-assembly..

What if you assembled the cowl/dash to the floorboards and hat channels... Then assembled the parts from the riser aft, without the sides, or maybe even with the sides... so you essentially have two sections that could be tweaked one way or another, and when everything lines up you could fasten the floorboards to the riser and add the sides....

While working on my 3a I wondered if Classic Enterprises or maybe even MDJuan couldn't offer a repair "kit",,say everything aft of the floorboards, with some assembly required!
  

1955 CJ-5, A friend for 55 years....1951 CJ-3A, a new addition. 1929 Model A Ford Closed Cab Pickup...
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
athawk11
YaBB Administrator
Owner Member 2012
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


1949 CJ3A

Posts: 2771
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Joined: 01/26/11
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #6 - 06/12/13 at 16:16:05
Print Post  
This is fun…watching great minds work through this challenge.

I’m sure Rommel Juan or his crew could help us with the best approach, but this is more fun.

The actual project is a conglomeration of 2 tubs, (one 2A and one 3A) a 4x8 sheet of steel, and a couple minor pieces from Classic Enterprises.   

As I read your responses, the approaches begin to meld.  It seems that starting from the inside and working outward while utilizing the frame as a ‘jig’ is a consensus. 

Then, the joining of the front sub assembly to the rear sub assembly, then finally adding the outside rear quarters for the finishing touch.

I’ve clamped the tub together, then adjusted as needed a half dozen times so far….all on the garage floor.  I’ve cleaned and primed areas that are more difficult to do on a fully assembled tub. 

Because this thread was moved to the FAQ section, I’ll post the progress here and in the thread I have going on the Project Page.

Thank you again for your thoughts. 

Tim
  

2-1949 CJ3A 
1-1946 CJ2A
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
1955CJ-5
Flatfender Master
2013 Sponsor Member
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


It wasn't always green....

Posts: 2338
Location: Boise, idaho
Joined: 12/18/12
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #7 - 06/12/13 at 18:31:25
Print Post  
The challenge of "how to do it" is such a big part of this process...it's easy to spend a couple of days thinking through a process and then spending 15 minutes doing it...

Your rear floor/bed rework looked really good, and that bed plays a huge part in squaring everything and stiffening the structure....

I can't wait to see the result

Randy
  

1955 CJ-5, A friend for 55 years....1951 CJ-3A, a new addition. 1929 Model A Ford Closed Cab Pickup...
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
NoCoWillys
3A Lover
**
Offline


Still Plays With Jeeps

Posts: 87
Location: Strasburg, CO
Joined: 06/18/12
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #8 - 06/13/13 at 02:15:34
Print Post  
In my tub rebuild I replaced the top cowl, dash, firewall, driver side front quarter panel, driver floor, driver hat channel, and the rear taillight panels, valance and surround.  I don't think it all came back together square, but you can't really tell.  I don't think it was square to begin with.  I did the top cowl, dash and firewall as a unit. It seems to hold things close to in place as I added it to the rest of the body.  I think the sidle panel was the trickiest.
  

'53 CJ3a
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
athawk11
YaBB Administrator
Owner Member 2012
2016 Sponsor Member
2015 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline


1949 CJ3A

Posts: 2771
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Joined: 01/26/11
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #9 - 03/16/14 at 14:36:46
Print Post  
The tub reassembly turns out to be more common sense than rocket science.  As others have stated in this thread, the best approach is to work from the middle of the tub, to the outside of the tub.  There are variances that we can take, but you must always consider ‘Access’.  Some parts that need to be attached can be very difficult to get at with your welder, and even harder to see while you’re welding.  Particularly, the rear wheel house areas.

A few bullet points…

-      Keep it square.  (or at least as square as you can)
-      Use your frame as a jig.  (This will assure the tub will fit right when you’re done)
-      Work from the inside to the outside.
-      Lot’s of clamps and vise grips.
-      Clean welding surfaces.

I used a simple wire feed welder for this assembly.

I needed two tubs to make a single decent tub.  One 2A and one 3A tub.  I started with a decent cowl, dash, firewall and transmission hump assembly.  If you don’t have at least this, you may want to consider a new tub assembly from MD Juan.

 


You can purchase nearly every part of the tub separately. Keep this in mind when you come across a part that isn’t salvageable.

I made the floor pans.



I purchased the floor channels.  These were $140.00 and worth every penny.

With my cowl, hump assembly on the frame, and the rotten floors cut away, I clamped the pieces of the hat channels to the frame.  I aligned them with the tub mounts on the frame, and the tub.  This is critical.  This will assure the tub will bolt up to the frame when you’re done with your build. 



Once the channels were positioned, I clamped them all together, took them off the frame and welded this sub-assembly together.




Once the channels were together, I put them back on the frame to check alignment.  Next, I installed, the front floor pans.



I put this assembly back on the frame, then slid the channels into position for final mock up.  Once the channels were aligned with the frame and tub, I clamped them into position, removed the tub, then welded them on.



I drilled and bolted this assembly to the frame.  I used the rubber body mounts for correct positioning. 

With the front of the tub complete, I moved my focus to the rear.  This may be an unusual approach, but in my mind, this would assure the rear area would stay square and flat. The rear floor was welded to the wheel houses.



Next, I clamped the purchased floor riser to the front tub assembly and the frame.  I set the rear floor and wheel house assembly on the frame and aligned it with the floor riser.






I drilled the rear mounting holes and bolted it all to the frame.  With everything clamped and bolted, I welded the front assembly, the riser, and the rear assembly together.




To keep the wheel houses square, I needed to attach the tailgate surround, the rear valence, and the two rear panels.





Next, the wheel house supports were welded in.





The rear quarter panels and supports could now be installed.





And finally, the tool box.





Keep in mind, other things like seat frames, tail gates, and gas tanks need to fit right.  Have these items on hand while you’re putting your tub together.  You will want to test fit them, and make adjustments as needed.


This is just one approach to putting a tub back together.  You may not need to go to this extent.  Generally, it’s a good idea to keep as much of the tub together as you can.  In this case, I had no choice but to take it down this far.
  

2-1949 CJ3A 
1-1946 CJ2A
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Bob W
Flatfender Master
Owner Member 2012
2016 Sponsor Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 2159
Location: Monticello, NY
Joined: 10/19/10
Gender: Male
Re: 3A Tub-Some Assembly Required!
Reply #10 - 03/17/14 at 00:44:58
Print Post  
I don't have any photos of the Willys body assembly line but I do have this photo from American Central during WWII. Looks like they built up the bodies into a front and a rear sub-assembly and then welded the two halves together.

  

Bob W
Back to top
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Print
Bookmarks: Facebook Google Google+ Linked in Twitter Yahoo