Willys industrial Hobart welder. How to separate?

[specialty]

Is there any difference between the L134 Willys industrial engine used in like Hobart welders compared to the standard engine used in the Jeeps mechanically?

Ron

[athawk11]

Hi Ron,

I don't know much about them, but...

There is a pretty good, and recent discussion about the Industrial L-134s at the 2A Page.

http://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/cylinder-head-id_topic39435.html

[specialty]

Hello Tim,
I read what they said. Seems the compression is the same and the only difference is the bore size of the carburetor is smaller which would restrict HP. I might be getting one of these with low hours so looks to me like just switching the carburetors would do.

[mbullism]

Hello Tim,
I read what they said. Seems the compression is the same and the only difference is the bore size of the carburetor is smaller which would restrict HP. I might be getting one of these with low hours so looks to me like just switching the carburetors would do.

If memory serves, the compression is the same but the volume in the head is shaped differently.� You'll typically need a new intake as the bore on the intake will be smaller to match the carb.� There can be other nuances, like the lack of an oil pan skid plate, a thermostat housing that indexes straight ahead... pesky stuff that adds up...

ETA: the one on the left is an industrial head off a pe95 genset, the one on the right a more typical 2A/3A head... I don't recall the casting numbers from here, but there is a difference.  I have no idea what the difference means, though lol.  I'm of the opinion that it makes a difference or they wouldn't have done it 

[specialty]

good point. I never thought about that. I think I could just take the things I need off my motor and swap them over until I can get my original motor rebuilt. It runs okay but is losing oil pressure after getting hot and idling. So when I get into it I want to go through the whole thing.
Thanks,
Ron

[squidtone]

I believe both engines I've rubbed elbows with for my CJ are INDUSTRIALS. The one that came with my Jeep was a late model L head block with the large bellhousing flange, with the INDUSTRIAL head on it. The block had no numbers over the waterpump. I saved the head (here is a picture of that head with no gasket:)



NOte how there is a "combustion chamber" that is circular over the cylinder bore, and it's about 0.080- 0.100" in depth. Vehicle heads (I believe) do not have chambers that big; there is only a wedge shape halfway across the cylinder toward the valve pocket area.

While I think they used the same casting number to make either industrial or vehicle heads, they definitely did not skim the industrial head surfaces as much. In fact where the screwdriver is in the picture you can see a coolant passage that didn't get revealed because the machining wasn't deep enough. I had to knock it out.
The compression ratio must be different despite what info (6.48) is embossed on the head surface. I got another engine, and it also seems like an industrial. It has no numbers by the waterpump, and has it's original pistons and factory letter stamps for piston sizing stamped by the bores.
One thing I've never seen mentioned are the odd springs on the stems of the intake valves. I think this is for industrials only as well.



Anyway, those are my "two cents" to add to the discussion.

[specialty]

Very interesting. So did you use another head on the engine or use the industrial one?

[squidtone]

Specialty,
I swapped the Industrial head (in photo above) onto the "replacement" engine I acquired. My replacement engine I suspect is also an Industrial, but it came with a plain, cracked-from-freezing Willys Jeep vehicle head on it. So I swapped on my Industrial head. It runs fine, but I can't subjectively comment on the delta in power compared to a normal head powerplant...I've never driven a vehicle-headed L134 before.

When the time comes for engine work (if ever), I'd probably either seek out a passenger head, or have this one milled down to get rid of the extra chamber volume.

[specialty]

Okay, I bought the welder last weekend. The motor runs excellent. Fired right up in 20 degree weather and ran flawlessly. Other than being converted to 12 volt the whole unit seems unmolested and very functional. I need to separate the engine from the armature and hope to sell the rest if anybody is interested. This thing has a huge radiator, carb, armature, cabinet, fuel tank, and many other real nice parts on it that I hate to scrap out. Anyone separated one of these before? Seems I read someplace it can be a little tricky but can't find the story anymore. I am going to use my original manifold and carburetor. Anyone see anything else I may need to swap in the pics?
Anyone interested in this unit minus the engine let me know.

Ron

[mbullism]

That thermostat housing will likely not work very well... measure the engine plate for width at the mounts, at the very least it appears 2A (assuming this is going in a 3A)... no skidplate on the oil pan.  You'll want to drop the pan anyway and just verify it has a floating pickup, at the very least....

[Birddog7]

Hate to see you remove that engine out of there. That is a nice original setup welder. But you have to do what you have to.

[specialty]

Yes it's all there and unmolested except for the man painted it. Engine runs perfect. If I can't sell it intact I may just cover it up in the back of the garage and re-install the engine after I get my original engine rebuilt one of these days.

[specialty]

That thermostat housing will likely not work very well... measure the engine plate for width at the mounts, at the very least it appears 2A (assuming this is going in a 3A)... no skidplate on the oil pan.� You'll want to drop the pan anyway and just verify it has a floating pickup, at the very least....

I noticed no skid plate. I don't know about the thermostat housing yet. Wonder if I should do another rear main seal? The one in it is not leaking and I hate to fix something that is not broke. Especially since these newer seals seem to have some issues.

[mbullism]

Wonder if I should do another rear main seal? The one in it is not leaking and I hate to fix something that is not broke. Especially since these newer seals seem to have some issues.

Do you frequently walk up to get in your daily driver and ponder replacing an oil seal that isn't leaking? 

[specialty]

No, not really. But some would say do it while it's easy to get to!