I Have a Herd!!

[athawk11]

I've been looking for a 'Project'. �Yesterday, I found a pair of Willys Jeeps. �One is a 1946 2A. �The other is a PEC (Pretty Early) 1949 3A. �Because this is the 3A page, I primarily want to share the 3A. �I will post the 2A stuff at the 2A page.

I just got them home last night. �It was darn cold here in Colorado, so I had no interest in digging too deep for serial #s, castings, etc. �It should be a bit warmer this weekend. �I'll post more information as I get it.

I'm not entirely sure why I got this 3A...other than it was a package deal. �The PO had the intention of combining them into one Willys. �The 2A may turn out to be too special to do this. �I'm currently calling the 3A, 'The White One'.

What I know: �1949 CJ3A #13655. �Still has a body tag. �It runs if you pour gas in the carb. �It does not stop (what's new). �It has a front PTO with the biggest PTO driven winch I've ever seen on the front of a Willys. It turns freely. �The tub is a disaster. �If it's not covered in bondo, it's had heavy plate steel patch welded. �

So...Will it be a Thrasher??? � Will it be a keeper to eventually restore?? �Part it out?? � I just don't know yet. �Stay tuned.

Tim












 ï¿½

[Ryan_M]

Very exciting stuff! Congrats on the arrival of your new "children". So when do you start the garage renovation/expansion project?

[F Bill]

I noticed it isn't a Willys, it is a BROWN!  Love the winch.....and the general overall appearance of a real working jeep.

And by the way three jeeps may or may not actually count as a herd..... You still have a possibility of hiding three. It is when you have so many you cannot hide their existence that a true herd formation has been discovered.

Looking forward to hearing more.. What is  special about the 2A?

[garage gnome]

From the looks of it and your post on the 2A page, you have enough stuff to build one pretty nice one there!

[Bedrock]

Way to go Tim. �These new additions should keep you occupied for a while. �We'll be looking forward to additional photos and updates......on a regular basis.


George

[Bob W]

Hi Tim,

I like your new PEC CJ-3A    Naturally I'd like to see more photos too. What is the body tag number? Can you see the original hood block holes on the inside of the hood? If so what is the spacing from the center seam? Does it have a Type 1A or 1B right front fender? See this page for the different fender types...
http://www.cj3a.info/tech/rfender.html
Too many questions?

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!

[athawk11]

Hey guys.  Thanks for taking a look.  This is a true beater.  It's been used and abused.  I kind of like that about it.

Ryan, no garage expansion in the cards.  I'm going to have to figure something out.  Right now, I have to figure out how to convince the neighbors that I'm not opening up a new junk yard

Bill, I'm not sure yet if the 2A is special beyond the frame and tub match.  The engine might be original.  It's got pretty solid sheet metal.  As much as I like my first OD 3A, it represents probably 20 or 30 different Willys combined into one.  

Has anyone ever seen a winch like this?  Haven't had a chance to dig into it yet.

Tim

[BMIC]

Congrats Tim,
 Your two new rescues will help all of us get through the rest of the winter. Pull up the chairs and grab a beer, this is going to be good reading.

[Quebec Jeep]

It already got a name, it's Brown!

[athawk11]

Okay, �Some additional information. �The tub is shot. �Seriously. �There are so many holes in this thing, someone must have taken a shotgun to it. �The Tranny hump is broken into 3-4 pieces. �The floors have been patched, badly. �I crawled under to take a look. �The original steel just crumbles in my hand. �Bottom line, if I decide to keep this together, I'm in the market for a replacement tub. �Front sheet metal is in good condition.

Here are the numbers.

Serial: � � �13655
Body Tag: 13115
Engine: � � 3J 39316

After thumbing through Bob Westerman's book, this Willys was probably made in mid to late January 1949. �Only 3654 3As were made before this one. �The body tag is off by 540. �Bob mentions some reasons why this could have happened. �I wonder if this 540 makes sense based on the build date?

The engine is not original to this Willys, but it is a 3A engine.

Edit:  I forgot to answer a couple more of Bob's questions...It has the Type A1 fender and the hood blocks are not equadistant from the center seam.

Tim

[Ryan_M]

How can you tell it's not the original engine? I know you mentioned it was red but didn't the number above the water pump boss get ground off on the red rebuilt/replacement motors?

[athawk11]

That's a good question Ryan. �The engine is red. �Perhaps a reputable shop put the effort into restamping the boss. �Or maybe it didn't need to be resurfaced when rebuilt. �Or maybe a PO liked red engines. �I wonder if Bob, Larry, Carl, Gun....someone knows if the font in the photo above looks original??? �

The '3' in front of the 'J' looks different than the '3s' in the Serial#.  Also, the '1' is pretty unique.

[F Bill]

That's a good question Ryan. �The engine is red. �Perhaps a reputable shop put the effort into restamping the boss. �Or maybe it didn't need to be resurfaced when rebuilt. �Or maybe a PO liked red engines. �I wonder if Bob, Larry, Carl, Gun....someone knows if the font in the photo above looks original??? �

The '3' in front of the 'J' looks different than the '3s' in the Serial#. �Also, the '1' is pretty unique.

At first glance it looks right to me. Very consistent with other stamps I have seen, but I haven't seen as many as Bob has..I also noticed the different leading 3.. I wonder if perhaps the engines were all stamped 3J and then later in the process the actual serial number  was added by a worker with a different set of stamps.

[Bob W]

Thanks Tim for answering the questions and posting more photos!!!!!!!!!!!

The engine serial number font looks original. It is unlikely that engine was originally installed in that Jeep because the skew is so far off.

There seems to be an internet legend that red engines are rebuilt. Anyone can paint an engine red without doing anything else. I think this legend came from the fact that new Willys replacement engines were red. This red may have been the sealer that was applied to the castings and so these new engines were actually unpainted. The red sealer can be seen on many original engines where the black top coat paint is peeling off. I have never seen any documentation that indicates Willys did any rebuilding of engines although many aftermarket companies did.

[athawk11]

Thanks Bill.  Thanks Bob.  I fell into that legend.  I thought everything on the internet had to be the truth.

How about the body tag scew?  540 sound about right for the build date?

Tim