CJ3B REAR 9" to 11" upgrade

[maximus966]

Hello Al!

Didi the 11" drum upgrade to my CJ3B a couple of years ago, and it works beautifully.

Found another set of backing plates, and will work on the rear now...  my question is, in the image below, which would be rear left and right?

http://www.the-jeep-guy.com/BRAKE%20KIT%20DRUM.JPG

Thanks!

[Rus Curtis]

maximus,
The original 9" brakes had a hard anchor at the bottom vs. your 11" brakes, aka modern, that instead has an adjuster at the bottom - or opposite the wheel cylinder.  Our original brakes need the smaller shoe on the back in order to create maximum braking (by pushing through the cylinder) where the larger shoe is forced into the drum as it rotates.  So, large shoe in the front, small shoe in the back. 

The simple answer is yours is opposite. 

The auto adjusting anchor at the bottom, unlike the hard anchor we have, actually moves so the orientation is swapped; The smaller shoe is front and as it pushes into the drum, that forces the anchor at the bottom to increase the force of the larger shoe into the drum creating more braking.  I believe that's called self energizing or servo effect (not sure about the terminology).

https://cj3apage.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4636.msg37684#msg37684

[maximus966]

Hello Rus!

The pic in the attached link you sent with the green Jeep and Warn hub is precisely my Jeep, front passenger side...  that is when I did the front upgrade.

My question is (not sure if I was clear) which one on the pic in this thread today is the Left and Right rear...  nos sure if the star for the self adjuster goes to front or rear of the Jeep on what side, unless both sides are installed the same way. two similar left, two similar right).

Thanks for your time!

Jorge

[Rus Curtis]

The pic in the attached link you sent with the green Jeep and Warn hub is precisely my Jeep, front passenger side...

Ahh!  okay!  Jorge = maximus!!  lol  Nothing like using your own jeep as a photo reference 

My mention of the short shoe at the front may not have been clear.  Specifically, in your image, the inside (facing each other) shoes go forward.  The cable and star auto adjuster as well as the longer shoes go to the rear. 

This makes the backing plate/brake assembly on the left correct for your jeep's right side and the assembly on the right correct for your jeep's left side.

The best advice I got from a brake mechanic was do one side at a time and use the other for reference (ensuring you put all the parts back on correctly).  You can do the same.  Use your front brakes to give you a visual reference to help orient your back brakes.  Making your back brakes match your front will ensure you've got all brake assemblies on the same way.

[maximus966]

Thanks for the confirmation!

Will make sure that I replicate the builds then on the rear.

Thanks!

Jorge

[Mark W.]

The rule with Bendix brakes has always been Tall Man stands to the rear. I have a question were there 11" rear brakes without E-Brakes? All the ones I have seen had E-Brakes. Which of course makes orientation very easy as the cable holes have to obviously go forward.

[SteveKfl]

Well, one thing I have learned dealing with my WILLYS DJ3A is... NEVER say "never", nor say "always".  Manuals have errors, mostly in pictorial representations, and so much depends on the "date" and "place" and "inventory at that time and place", as to what "was installed".
 
Brake shoe size?  Leading vs primary shoe?  "Floating shoes" vs "pivot design"?  The last question is the MOST IMPORTANT determination... IMO.  The 11" brakes being discussed are a "floating design" (self-adjusting) system.  "Short shoe" as the "leading shoe" going "forward", whether front or rear assembly... as "I" have read and understand it to be correct.  The shorter shoe was said to help heat dissipation, and to be a lighter shoe to activate first into the drum's forward rotation... or so as I read many times in many discussions researched.
 
Now where things get confusing and contradictory, is when "apples are compared to oranges", and when generalities are stated as "factual".  Example... my 62 DJ has Bendix backing plates, Wagner cylinders and the LOCKHEDE SYSTEM with a "pivot design" (fixed bottoms of shoes).  Btw, my drums and shoes are 9"X 2" with 1-1/8" front directional cylinders (l/r) and 9X2" rears with 13/16" cylinders.  ALL Willys "factory", but "different from most other Willys CJs, and also "different" is the 2WD front axle beam.
 
That said, the "leading shoe" for the "pivot design" towards the front of the vehicle is the "LONG SHOE", with the short shoe as the "trailing shoe".  THAT is different from the "floating system" in that the "leading shoe" for the FS is the "primary shoe" in a forward direction... pushing the "trailing/secondary shoe" into the cylinder, or trying to.  Now when backing up (self-adjusting), the formerly "secondary shoe" (trailing/rear shoe) becomes the "primary shoe" with the "floating system"... HUH??????  Yep, it is all in how you describe it, and what system being used, and which "direction of rotation", of when "SIZE MATTERS".  On the "pivot non-self-adjusting system"... UP FRONT...  the "primary answer" is "size matters"...bigger is better... lol.
 
AS usual, the question of "does size matter" still remains.  It depends on "who is asking, how is it is used", and what your "experience was like", NOT what the PO had, or did... ???  ;-)
 
One has to enjoy all of the "different" experiences around Willys!!!