T90 front seal

[farm1810]

Greetings all,
I have a T90 that I put a new front seal (felt) into.  In driving the Jeep it is leaking a great deal.  I realize now that I made some mistakes.  1.  I didn't pack the felt with grease before placing it into place (although I did lightly grease it).  2. I didn't use 1/2 of the old felt along with the entire new one (a suggestion from a more experienced Willys mechanic who has rebuilt many of these). 

My questions are: 1.  As the felt gets saturated will it swell and leaking be reduced?  2.  Assuming I am taking the trans back out, has anyone used the sealed bearing in the front?  I have had someone tell me to not use the felt if I use the sealed bearing.  Another said to remove the seal that faces the oil so the bearing gets lubricated and is not totally reliant on the mfg packing.  Yet another said to tap the oil return home and block it if using the sealed bearing.  And another questioned the orientation of the front bearing retainer / cover. 

Thoughts and suggestions are appreciated.  Thanks.

[farm1810]

Update.  Pulled it back out today.  Gear oil present in the bell housing, not motor oil.  Took the front bearing retainer off, had the felt seal in place, dry in front of the felt.  Gasket covered the entire area of the front of the transmission to bell housing area.  Grrrr.  I was hoping to see something I did wrong.  OH, the drain in the cover / bearing retainer was aligned with the hole going back into the trans.  So...  I have a sealed bearing coming on Tuesday.  I am going to pull the seal off the inner side.  I am going to press / grease a new felt into place and leave the drain open even thought Novak suggests plugging that.  I am going to slather (is that a word?) Perm non hardening gasket stuff over the entire surface then apply a full coverage gasket.  Anything else I should do other than have another Bloody Mary?  Thanks for your support.  Really helps.

[athawk11]

Just one comment based on your plan...

There is no value to the sealed bearing if you leave the drain hole open.

[Rus Curtis]

Image from 3B Page:


Are you talking about leak coming from 1-8 assembly?  The front of the transmission?

Update.  ....Took the front bearing retainer off, had the felt seal in place, dry in front of the felt....

If I'm following correctly, this tidbit from your post means to me the gear oil ISN'T leaking down the Main Drive Gear shaft past the felt and out of the Bearing Retainer cover.  If it were seaping out, the felt would be saturated. 

The gasket between the bearing retainer and case could be leaking.

There is a lower shaft #41, that protrudes out the front of the case.  Have you sealed that off?

From the same article that the above image is from:

https://cj3b.info/Tech/T90Fluids.html

There is a paragraph covering the Countershaft leaking.

[farm1810]

Thanks for that link.  Mine was dripping from the hole at the bottom of the bell housing.  When I removed the trans, I ran my finger inside the bell housing on the trans side and there was oil lining that area.  The clutch and most of the pressure plate were clean and had no oil on them EXCEPT the three fingers of the pressure plate where the throw out bearing touch.  What has baffled me is that the inside of the tube / front bearing support was totally dry in front of the felt seal.  I did see on another site that someone had a leak at the gasket for that front cover, evidently the cover was tightening against the outer snap ring on the bearing instead of pulling up tight against the cast.  I had not sealed the countershaft but will be doing that.  There was an accumulation of oil in the area of the lower oil collection screw, but the gasket covered that and I don't think that was the leak.  I will be using sealer around these openings along with the new gasket.  Question:  If I use the sealed bearing is there more than the one opening that I need to plug i.e. the oil return? 

[Rus Curtis]

Posting images of what you're looking at for leaks would help immensely. 

I may have used a gasket between the transmission/bell housing once, I don't remember.  I haven't now for a long while.  To me, any seepage of fluid you see on the outside is a potential leak.  So try to follow back to where it may have come from.

The leaks you were observing inside the bell housing, before disassembling, had you topped off the gear boxes with lube before driving?  How do you park the jeep, nose down on a slope?

I've never used the sealed bearing.  I can't offer advice on that.  I found all the leaks on my transmission and didn't need to do anything else.

[farm1810]

I used the sealed bearing.  Used Permatex form-a-gasket for gear oil and no gasket under the front cover.  I tapped the oil return hole and blocked it, sealed the threads.  I used the Permatex to seal the end of the counter shaft (I put a layer in the void, the shaft is about .060 below the casting surface, so I filled that and wiped flush with a putty knife, allowed that to sit overnight) and the Permatex in place of the gasket between the trans and bell housing.  I have driven it about 5 - 6 miles now with no leaks at all.  Thanks so much to all for the great advice.  Oh, I did not put a felt seal in place either.