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Author Topic: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?  (Read 9879 times)

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Offline Mike S

225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« on: February 18, 2014, 01:09:52 PM »
I am completing my 2A build to stock specs (with a few exceptions). Now contemplating building a modified Jeep.

I have a good '48 lefty tub, an SM420, and am about to buy a running (complete) 225 V6 being removed from a Commando, which I will mate to a Spicer 18 Tcase. I would like to put all this in a 3A chassis with Dana 44 rear and (possibly) a Dana 27 front. Saginaw PS probably.

I think this has been done about a zillion times, but are there any gotcha's in assembling all this stuff?

Thanks
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Offline garage gnome

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2014, 08:16:22 PM »
Not familiar with the SM420, but I know it is not the easiest thing to adapt to the D18 and v6. Easiest way to do this is a T18 with a ford input shaft and a large hole D18. The stock 225 v6 bell can be drilled and tapped for the T18 mounting holes. You would need a T18 with a "texas" pattern on the back side. This is what I did for my jeep.
Nate in Western MA 1953 3A #3268, The Jalopy, '47 2A Wheelin' rig, '49 3A, #37071, unmolested, bone stock named Ted

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2014, 01:23:30 AM »
Thanks, Nate. I was thinking I would use a standard BOP bell with a Jeep flywheel to attach the SM420 to the engine. Novak's has an adaptor for the SM420 to D18.

Not sure if I will have to removes the factory battery tray or how I will route the steering around the factory 225 exhaust. Ought to be a fun project, tho'.
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Offline duffer

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2014, 10:10:55 PM »
I would likely use the SM465 because it is the shorter package and gives you a longer rear driveshaft.  You would have to get the index machined on the BOP bell.  Downside is that it is 40 to 50 lbs more than the SM420.

Also, don't waste your time with the D27.  I've had more problems with those than the D25's.  May as well just go for a D30 that is definately an upgrade.  I believe 76-86 have discs.  The rear D44 should at a minimum be the 19 spline version.  Better would be Herm's 30 spline full floater or the rare as hell 70 1/2 - 71 30 spline flanged axle.

I would also be boxing the frame but that would depend on the anticipated use.
48 2A, 49 3A, 51 Wagon, 55 3B, 57 FC 150, 57 Wagon, 60 FC 170, 68 CJ 5, 2012 JKUR

John, Bozeman, MT

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2014, 12:23:43 PM »
Duffer -- Thanks for the advice. I can't imagine a tranny that is 50lbs. heavier than the SM420 I wrestled out of the back of my truck the other day. Since I already have it and it's in good shape, I'll likely use it. I am hoping that I will be able to move the engine forward a bit to help compensate for the additional length. Not sure how much I can get without firewall or other issues.

I have had zero issues with the D25 in my current 2A. I have a Warn FF rear w/ a Lock Right in the D41 with Warn Internal Hubs. This is a strong combo with beefy chrome moly axles. If I can buy a 3A chassis, then I can start with a D44 and build it.

Thanks again.
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Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2014, 04:01:54 PM »
PROGRESS...

I bought a newly built 225 V6 (Offy DP intake, Sanderson headers, Comp Cams RV grind, new lifters, pistons, etc.) from a member on the earlyCJ5 BBS. Now planning on a Ford T18 with advanced adaptors short bell housing. I will need to sort out frame mounts for the motor and trans, etc.

Here's the engine:

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Offline Bill04SD

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Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2014, 07:28:34 PM »
If you don't already have a frame/chassis I'd look for a factory V6 CJ5 chassis.  It'll have the engine mounts, longer springs, and a 19 spline dana 44.

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2014, 01:25:54 PM »
Quote
If you don't already have a frame/chassis I'd look for a factory V6 CJ5 chassis.� It'll have the engine mounts, longer springs, and a 19 spline dana 44.

That's a good idea... any idea how much trouble it is to fit a 2A tubs to the CJ5 chassis?

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Offline F Bill

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2014, 03:45:36 PM »
Here's a link to the 3B page article on using the Cj5 chassis.

http://cj3b.info/Tech/FrameCJ5.html

It is not a 3A or a 2A but the 3B flatfender is basically the same idea.

Well worth doing as suggested, especially if you are starting from scratch or have a bad frame.
Owner of the world famous?? Pintojeep 3A and one yet to be named stock project 3A.
Based in central TX and upstate NY.

Offline Cadwelder

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Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2014, 04:36:48 PM »
The frame from an early CJ5 will easily work under a flatty body. The frame rails themselves are identical with the exception of an extra 2-1/2" of length on the front horns, and 3" extra on rear. Crossmembers, spring hangers,  and shock mounts are located a little differently, and the front crossmember is rectangular instead of round. Body mount brackets (those that weren't omitted at the factory) are in the same place.
The only downside I see to using a 5's frame under a flatty is the extra length. It may not be obvious in the front, but having the rear crossmember sticking out 3" just isn't right. and you'd lose the rear body mount locations.
I started to modify a V6 CJ5 frame to a 3's dimensions when I found bigger issues with 5 (paper thin in spots). Have since repaired the 3A frame and have it at the sandblaster now.
CJ3A, 225/SM420/D18 (twin stick) 25/44 4.27:1 Repro body

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #10 on: June 28, 2014, 03:41:21 PM »
Thanks. If the CJ5 frame is 3" longer, it sounds like some surgery would be needed - on the frame or the tub. Probably won't go there.

Is the CJ3B frame the same (or nearly so) as the CJ3A frame?

Thanks again,

Mike
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Offline Cadwelder

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Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2014, 06:46:54 PM »
As far as I know, 3A and 3B frames are interchangeable.  Modifying a 5 frame is not that hard if you end up having to go that route...contact me if you do, and I can provide some details.
CJ3A, 225/SM420/D18 (twin stick) 25/44 4.27:1 Repro body

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2014, 02:30:14 PM »
Thanks, Cadwelder. Much appreciated.
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Offline Bill04SD

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Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2014, 09:22:29 PM »
It's not to hard to modify the 5 frame to get the crossmember back under the body.  As stated above you really don't notice the extra length up front.  I've done two flatfenders now with CJ5 chassis.  Both of the ones I did used 1970 CJ5 chassis so I also picked up the dual circuit master cylinder as a bonus.

Offline Mike S

Re: 225 V6, SM420 and 2A tub on 3A chassis?
« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2014, 07:20:22 PM »
Well, if it is not a hassle and doesn't look like a deformity... wonder if I could find a CJ5 225 frame with the motor mounts still in it?

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