My Willys 3A and 3B Community
TECH FAQ SECTIONS => Chassis, brakes and suspension. => Topic started by: TToonz on September 02, 2023, 06:59:41 PM
-
Hi folks-
Simple question: I have a '51 CJ3A which came to me from a gentleman who claimed it was Navy surplus. The pedigree aside- I have a minor wrinkle to hammer out...
...I need to replace the V-bracket that connects the frame rails to the rear crossmember where the pintle hook bolts up. Rust had it's way with the crossmember and the V bracket.
I'd like to replace the V-bracket without removing the body if possible...
That's my question- is it possible? Anyone ever do that with the body still on the frame? I know it would be worlds easier to do it on a bare frame, but my current garage condition makes that pretty much impossible.
Any hints, tips, tricks, etc would be most welcome...
Thanks!
-
Toonz,
This your first post? Welcome!
I saw your post over on the 2A forum. I hesitated posting there as you were getting some opinions.
Here goes mine (FWIW)...
You mentioned removing frame pieces and replacing welded/riveted attachments with just bolts. If I were to do this, I would remove the tub bolts (also detach the fenders from the tub) and see how much you could tilt the tub up off the frame in the rear. Getting to the top of the frame for proper re-attachment may really help.
I don't know why now but took some pictures of that joint you're referring to (see below). You'll see the body attachment point is welded to both the "V" and the crossmember. Note that the crossmember is both riveted and welded. I think tipping the tub up, you'll be better able to get the rusted brace out and have better access to ensure a good welding when installing the replacement - not to mention painting the frame back up when complete. I also took a photo of the pintle plate and its weldings but it's so out of focus, I had to label the welds when sharing this with the shop that did my framework. Do take a lot of pictures as you go since memory will not help as much as you think.
I think leaving the tub sitting on the frame will allow you to ensure fitment (also NOT removing the rear tub (#5 position) mounts will greatly enhance final tub fit. It also allows you to periodically drop the tub down, when needed, to check. I think the tub could be raised enough to allow for jack stands (or other sturdy brace) to keep the tub up out of your way. As I sit and "arm-chair" this, I'm thinking the tub may have to slide back an inch or two as the firewall may contact the back of the engine when tilted. IF this tilt idea works, at least you can leave the tub on top of the frame and not take up more garage real estate (and I think all the wiring can remain attached).
If you're planning on just a pintle, I don't believe the inner reinforcement to the rear cross member is needed but is listed as part of the draw bar installation. I think you mentioned in your other post you had all the parts.
Curious to see how this repair goes.
-
Just to "add" another "consideration" to Rus's excellent option, I suggest you release the steering column from the dash, as well as don't forget to check the "gas filler area" for movement/binding potential too, and any other "frame to body" attachments (pedals, fuel lines, etc) depending on how far you might intend to "jack up" the body. It is easier to "re-connect" than to "fix" an "overlooked attachment"... IMO. SAFETY FIRST!!! Good Luck.
-
Wow- thanks, folks! :-)
I've already removed the most rearward body mounts, in the bed of the tub and jacked up the body a bit. It gave me enough room to see the rivets on the topside for that rear intermediate crossmember, but I dreamt about it all night, and I'm going to take out some more body mounts, which I'm sure will give me some more clearance. Since you're saying that the crossmember is welded in addition being riveted, that will slow me down a bit. I think I'm going to order in a new rear intermediate crossmember, in the event that I have to sacrifice it to get the job done. I'm sure I can cut it out without damaging the frame, but the member itself won't survive that, so...It just sounds easier to cut it out, clean up the frame, and refit the new parts, then bolt and weld.
With the body still on, even jacked- I'm thinking the best course of action is to take the whole intermediate crossmember out and replace that and the V bracket at the same time with new stuff. If I had a better garage setup, I'd just pull the body up a foot or two, but currently, that aint' happening...
My jeep is old and ugly- but it runs like a top. It's in drastic need of a new steel body, but that's going to have to wait until I have a new garage. If you saw where I was working right now, you'd let out that laugh of understanding...talk about tight spaces! :-)
Anyway- thanks for the input. If anything worthwhile comes of this minor project run amok, I'll be sure to post some photos here...
Best regards-
Tim