My Willys 3A and 3B Community
TECH FAQ SECTIONS => BODY and trim => Topic started by: Doug_3B on November 22, 2019, 08:00:19 PM
-
Hello guys, I'm looking for some opinions and observations from those who know.
I'm currently running a Koenig hard top on my 3B. Just putting it on today, as I normally do around this time of year. It usually comes off late March/ early April each year. When I got it 7 or 8 years ago, I did a quick resto on it, just to keep the snow/rain out of the Jeep during the winter. It's looking like its time for another, more complete resto this coming year - mostly sandblast and paint.
I'm considering going with a soft top and selling the hard top, but I never ran a soft top.
Several things I don't like about the hard top:
- LOUD!
- Blind spots - this is probably my biggest problem with the top, in fact, it will be driven very little with the top on due to this.
- Storage in the off season. Currently I store it in pieces outside.
- Lifting in into place. I can handle the top by myself now, but I'm not getting any younger.
One major thing I'm worried about with a soft top is yellowing of the windows, and weathering of the rest of it. Sun here in SW Idaho is intense even in the winter. I am not concerned with drilling more holes. I already have some that need to be welded up. Paint is chipping away, I'm thinking about a paint job in a couple of years.
So, do I just sell the hard top and invest in a soft top or do I do a restoration on the Koenig again and cut out for larger windows?
Looking for your thoughts and experiences. Any pros/cons you've found running either the soft top or hard top.
thanks guys.
-
Doug,
When I first got my jeep ('late '70's) it had a hard top. I agree with everything you stated. It was a microwave in the summer and a freezer in the winter. It kept the insides dry though. Removing/installing was interesting. Things could be thrown in the back and even stacked without fear of cutting or ripping the sides out. The one thing I really didn't like was whoever put mine on was very random with where the screws went into the windshield frame and they really didn't seem to care (some even went through the soft top door channels). I didn't have space to store it, but if I'm being honest, I wouldn't mind it if I still owned it.
The only soft top I'm familiar with is the BestTop Tiger Top. It's quiet compared to the hard top. I could almost imagine it was warming up a bit quicker, when the heater was running. The ability to be able to raise/lower in a few minutes sold me. The windows can be maintained (I wasn't successful-mine yellowed and got brittle in the winter). I think parked inside would be the way to go. Back then my parking spot was out front in the street so it was always exposed to the elements. If you leave the top down and it turns cool, i.e. night or fall, it is difficult to stretch the sides to engage the snaps. Here, warmth (or direct sunlight) is your friend. My technique was to try and get it up before dusk (or the temp started to drop).
What really bothers me about the Tiger Top is you can't by a replacement top like the later CJ-5's or Wranglers. Also, no other options.
Just my opinion.
-
Thinking outside the box... if you are not concerned with "original look/function", and the fact that you are already indicating you're willing to cut for "bigger windows", what about installing two side "latching windows" like on an Astro mini-van (they are tinted glass), or "sun roof windows" on the side and/or back, to assist with ventilation. Even open they can resist most light rains open on the bottom. They have two latch points. I have an Astro with those windows, so I know that. In fact, the rear door windows on it single-latch also and are smaller if that fits your need better. Also, I used paintable rubberized sound deadener spray coating on the bare metal of the Astro's top and sides (interior removed) to quiet the vibrations there, and it may offer minimum insulation as well for quicker warm ups in winter. Just a thought to consider possibly. If needed, I can get you some pics of the windows with measurements.
-
I have purchased two Jeeps with hard 1/2 cabs in the past. Little windows on each and I pitched both before I knew they had any value. I have had a soft top on my 64 CJ 5 for years now. On in the fall off in the spring. Zippers have caused problems and the windows all have scratches. It sets out side all year and feels like a cave when I put the top on in the fall. Would not drive the Jeep in the winter in Wyoming with out the top. The heater will defrost the windshield and I have a heavy coat and gloves for warmth.
A full hard top with insulation and decent size windows might be better because it could be lockable and secure.
Both tops have good points. One bad thing about a new soft top is the price.
-
Rus,
Thank you for the information. I do wait until later in the year to put the top on so it's usually pretty cold - might not be too good for putting on a TigerTop. I can probably drape it over and then turn on the heater. I have an after market heater from JEGS stuffed under the dash - it pumps out about eleventy-billion BTUs; even on the cold days with no top or doors, your feet still burn up.
I hate that we don't have options for the Tiger Top, too. I'd love to park it inside during the winter, unfortunately, I don't have much space: I have a 3 car garage - all three bays are accounted for, and we have 5 more vehicles parked outside. I could probably get a cover for the Jeep for when I don't expect to use it very often. There is a guy down the street who told the HOA that my jeep is ugly as sin, not sure if a vehicle cover would make him happy or tick him off even more ;D ;D ;D
Doug,
When I first got my jeep ('late '70's) it had a hard top. I agree with everything you stated. It was a microwave in the summer and a freezer in the winter. It kept the insides dry though. Removing/installing was interesting. Things could be thrown in the back and even stacked without fear of cutting or ripping the sides out. The one thing I really didn't like was whoever put mine on was very random with where the screws went into the windshield frame and they really didn't seem to care (some even went through the soft top door channels). I didn't have space to store it, but if I'm being honest, I wouldn't mind it if I still owned it.
The only soft top I'm familiar with is the BestTop Tiger Top. It's quiet compared to the hard top. I could almost imagine it was warming up a bit quicker, when the heater was running. The ability to be able to raise/lower in a few minutes sold me. The windows can be maintained (I wasn't successful-mine yellowed and got brittle in the winter). I think parked inside would be the way to go. Back then my parking spot was out front in the street so it was always exposed to the elements. If you leave the top down and it turns cool, i.e. night or fall, it is difficult to stretch the sides to engage the snaps. Here, warmth (or direct sunlight) is your friend. My technique was to try and get it up before dusk (or the temp started to drop).
What really bothers me about the Tiger Top is you can't by a replacement top like the later CJ-5's or Wranglers. Also, no other options.
Just my opinion.
-
Steve,
Interesting thought on using windows that pop out. I wonder if having one or two of them cracked a little bit would also help to cut down on the noise. Definitely something to think about.
I used a 3M product, rubberized sound deadener, on the inside of the doors before I put the crank mechanisms in there. I had plans to get more and spray the rest of the inside of the top as well, but never did. If I end up restoring this one, that is a must-do this time for sure.
Thinking outside the box... if you are not concerned with "original look/function", and the fact that you are already indicating you're willing to cut for "bigger windows", what about installing two side "latching windows" like on an Astro mini-van (they are tinted glass), or "sun roof windows" on the side and/or back, to assist with ventilation. Even open they can resist most light rains open on the bottom. They have two latch points. I have an Astro with those windows, so I know that. In fact, the rear door windows on it single-latch also and are smaller if that fits your need better. Also, I used paintable rubberized sound deadener spray coating on the bare metal of the Astro's top and sides (interior removed) to quiet the vibrations there, and it may offer minimum insulation as well for quicker warm ups in winter. Just a thought to consider possibly. If needed, I can get you some pics of the windows with measurements.
-
Now there is something I hadn't thought about: securing things inside the jeep if it has a soft top. My doors now do not lock, but I found some locking handles online awhile back and plan to switch them out. I normally don't keep anything in the Jeep. But, if I'm going up into the hills and stop to go in the store for a couple minutes for snacks or whatever, I don't need firearms walking away.
The Tiger Tops are expensive for sure. That was what I was thinking with the yellowing of the windows and whether I was going to have to buy a new one every so many years.
I have purchased two Jeeps with hard 1/2 cabs in the past. Little windows on each and I pitched both before I knew they had any value. I have had a soft top on my 64 CJ 5 for years now. On in the fall off in the spring. Zippers have caused problems and the windows all have scratches. It sets out side all year and feels like a cave when I put the top on in the fall. Would not drive the Jeep in the winter in Wyoming with out the top. The heater will defrost the windshield and I have a heavy coat and gloves for warmth.
A full hard top with insulation and decent size windows might be better because it could be lockable and secure.
Both tops have good points. One bad thing about a new soft top is the price.
-
I bought two Koenig hardtops and love them. Try and find a new hard top. I insulated the roofs and covered them with panel board. Yes they all are noisy! The soft tops are colder, the snaps get dirty and won't unlatch, so until you learn to use a screwdriver to pop them, you pull the snaps out of the fabric. Never even think of rubbing the soft top windows. They scratch like crazy and if you don't like the Koenig glass windows, wait for the yellowed crap with scratches the soft top will have. Hard tops are heavy, but frankly I take them off in the summer. In the winter, I only drive when the roads are dry. The salt is suicide for your Jeep. I think the half cab is much easier to work with. The full cab usually gets left on and I put a 20,000 btu heater in it. Wow is that nice! Roll down windows is huge. Zippered soft top windows suck. Branches will pin stripe to death a soft top, windows included. The cost is actually more for a soft top than a used hard top. Lots of pluses to a hard top. So, there you have my opinion, and you may do as you like too! That said, windshield down, and drive it like a back woods sports car in the summer!!!!! 8)
-
I used this deluxe Koenig half cab for many years.
https://www.cj3b.info/Photos/Finds/Bushdiecker/Bushdiecker3B.JPG
It was fully seam sealed so I left it on year round but removed the side doors in the spring time.
The mini truck bed was actually rather handy. great place to haul an small boat engine / backpack / gas cans / camp stove / spare / firewood / you name it.
The deluxe models have excellent windows and visibility.
Mine was fully rebuilt and window cranks were all tight so it had no rattles at all.
Very easy to warm the cab with the standard fresh air type heater/ defroster.
Bestops are very easy to remove/install.
So that's there main plus.
You can carry the doors with you and install them quickly just before the clouds let loose.
But just touch a tree branch and your brand new soft top will have window scars.
The black vynyl itself is good for 10 years or more if left outdoors.
My next cab will possibly be a deluxe Kelly half cab with lockable doors.
It wasn't cheap but somehow I managed to locate and buy a NOS Kelly half cab for a 3A.
-
CHUG had a Kayline soft top when I drove it in high school we kept the windows clear with Johnsons Paste Wax. I didnt like the flapping at hwy speeds. I plan to build a insulated aluminum hard top.