My Willys 3A and 3B Community
3A, 3B, DJ Technical Knowledge Base => "Original"-- Technical Questions, Answers, Observations => Topic started by: Gunslinger on October 01, 2018, 07:20:57 PM
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Hey guys,
In that there were several 2A guys that were present when Triple X developed its noisy tranny at the FCT, I'm putting the discussion on the 2A page. Please join the discussion, I know I need help.
Todd ;)
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Todd, I couldn't find it there on the 2A - do you have a link? Or, maybe just check in here when you have updates. I was interested in learning what the issue was. To me it didn't quite sound like the clunk was as far back as the tranny - my money was on flywheel bolts!
It was great to meet you at the FCT! Good luck with your investigation.
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https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/triple-x-tranny-noise_topic43370.htm
Here you go Tom, good to meet you as well. Sue and I had so much fun at the FCT getting to know folks we've talked to on the forums for so long. What a deal.
I posted, well actually Muley posted my pics from the tranny. We did find a couple things, I'm taking it to a guy who knows these transmissions real well today. I need him to look it over and tell me whats going on. We did find some pieces that look like roller bearings, all broken up, and we found a good deal of yellow metal chips from the blocking rings. It looks like a re-build is in its future, just not sure how much of one. I can tell what really bad looks like, but I can't tell the difference between "that's not so good" and " that will be ok". IYou know what I mean. Still have some stuff to look at, going to pull the pressure plate and clutch disc to inspect them and we'll go from there. I have some tooth damage on the ring gear on the flywheel, may pull that and replace it as well. Looking a lot like a can of worms....
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Hey guys,
No updates yet on the noise, just a question, in review I have a T90 with a Dana 18 transfer case. In that I have the opportunity to make an upgrade here, tranny out, diagnosis, potential problem... I'm just wondering if you guys have any thoughts on upgrading to a 4 speed transmission and which one would you select? I was thinking about adding an overdrive as long as I have this apart, but maybe a 4 speed would be a better way to go.
Thoughts, ideas, criticism welcome.
Gun
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Check out all the info. on the Novak and/or Advance Adapters web sites. Advance Adapters builds the overdrive.
Lots of info on there pages. Novak was very helpful with my Pinto conversion in our M-38.
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Hey guys,
No updates yet on the noise, just a question, in review I have a T90 with a Dana 18 transfer case.� In that I have the opportunity to make an upgrade here, tranny out, diagnosis, potential problem... I'm just wondering if you guys have any thoughts on upgrading to a 4 speed transmission and which one would you select?� I was thinking about adding an overdrive as long as I have this apart, but maybe a 4 speed would be a better way to go.
Thoughts, ideas, criticism welcome.
Gun
High gear in a 4 speed is the same as high gear in a three speed.
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Hey guys,
Got the bad news Friday, still in shock. The guy I took the tranny too does a lot of trannies and axles for Midwest Military, he said he has never seen a transmission as bad as mine. At least I'm a winner there !.. Bottom line is $1500 for him to rebuild it, the roller bearings in the input shaft did come out and go into the intermediate shaft, apparently when it was rebuilt last time they left out one roller, that allowed enough space for accelerated wear, eventually breakage of rollers and then bingo. I'm going to go pick it up this week and get the nasty details, not sure what I'm going to do yet. Kaiser has a new t90 for $975.00, which looks like the easy button, but I did want to add an overdrive, so that kind of chews up the funds for that...with the parts I need to buy and the master rebuild kit I'm looking at $5-600 if I do it, but then I've never done one and confidence is low, I don't want to take it out again...
Suggestions?
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The last master rebuild kit I purchased had a counter shaft that was soft. It's a bearing surface and should be hard.
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Rebuild it!
We can all help with tips and tricks. It's actually kind of fun once you're in it. You would be surprised how rewarding it is. There really isn't that much that you can do wrong when rebuilding these T-90s.
Have faith my friend. :)
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Several youtube videos you can look at for rebuilding the t90.
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Hi Guys
Thought an update on the tranny problem was in order. I chickened out on the re-build, there is a guy just down the road the builds at lest one of these every week. Its his specialty. so I took it out and brought it to him, diagnosis was that the roller bearing on the input shaft went out. Most likely when it was build last time the builder left out one roller, so there must have been enough slop that after 5 years of wear a roller got sideways a bit, got chewed up and broke the rest loose. Bottom line was a full rebuild on the tranny and X-case, I also added an overdrive while it was out.
But thats not the end of the story, Since I've owned that truck the shift barrels have leaked when shifting, we could not find a fix for it so I bought a new one from Kaiser Willys, that fit up nicely, seems to work OK although I don't have a lot of miles on it since the install we got another 8 inches of snow last week) so not much driving going on. However I did not see any leaks !!!
Thanks for all the help, See you at the FCT.
Gun.
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Gun,
While I'm a little bummed that you didn't get beat up while doing your own rebuild, I do understand your reluctance. I was hoping for some fireside war stories/chats at the next gathering! [smiley=wink.gif]
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Don't worry Hawk, there will be some war stories... sometimes its prudent to hire mercenaries for a job so you can focus on the real challenge... Gun
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Well here is an update, the tranny is in, the overdrive installed, new clutch, new throw out bearing, and a new noise... read with interest Calvin and Aboyandhisdogs prolonged diagnosis on that noise. I have to say it seems my throw out bearing or my pilot bearing may be the culprit. Will be spending time on that soon I guess. In the meantime I'm getting familiar with Dad's old M38A1, we just finished that as a tribute jeep to him. Keep on jeepin!
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Sorry to hear about the noise, Todd. But good to hear the tranny is all hunky-dorey now! How does it drive? Are you loving that over drive? The OD was one of the upgrades I did, that now, I don't think I could live without. With any luck, your "noise" is just something unrelated that will be sorted out soon. Keep us apprised...
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Well guys the hits just keep on coming. I posted earlier that I have a significant oil leak at the rear of the shift tower, the barrels that house the shift rods are apparently worn so oil is sprayed up on the shift rods and works its way out of the tower when I shift. I thought the easiest way to address it would be to just buy a new tower from KW. You know, new tranny, new tower, no leaks.
Well the tower assembled to the tranny just fine, little tight but no forcing needed. That was the good news, on driving the tranny made the most awful squalling, I thought a dying pig was in the jeep, made noise in every gear, but not all the time, just when shifting then it went away when driving, I looked all over for it, finally took off the shift tower and put the original back on, all of the noise went away, smooth shifting. great! In looking at the KW shift tower I found 1. a casting repair in the tower that was not done well, it leaked oil at a fair rate. 2. both of the shift forks had grinding marks on them in various locations, where they had rubbed on internals of the tranny. Nice!.. drained the tranny and Tcase, a fair amount of metal chips came out with the oil, flushed with a 0-16W full synthetic motor oil, drained again, no chips, refilled with GL-1 80/90. BTW I talked to KW about it, they said return the part, full refund, no argument, no issues. Good customer service.
So Now I'm back to square one. I still have a shift tower that leaks at the rear through the shift rod boss. I saw that there are some posts on grinding flats on the shift rods to allow drainage, I also saw a mention of drilling the housing to allow oil to flow back into the tranny from the shift rod boss. Has anyone done that, it seems like the easy fix and does not require disassembly.
Tim, yes the overdrive is awesome, and when I finally get done with this project I will enjoy it. Again, this is Triple X we are talking about; everything must be done 3 times before its over!
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There are a few ways to solve this issue.�
1. Originally, there were 2 plugs (small round discs) on the back of the rails.� These might be hard to find�and do seem to get pushed out by the rails and lost.� Try to find a set.
2. Find an M38 shift tower.� This version has threaded plugs.
3. Take my approach seen below�.
This is a little mini-project I did a few years back when I installed a sealed bearing on the front of the T-90.� I wanted to seal both the front and rear.� For the front, I went down to my local hardware store and purchased 2- ��� (maybe 1/2") copper pipe caps.� I trimmed their length a bit.� I cleaned the port, added some sealant and drove them in with a hammer.
For the rear, I made a small plate.� I drilled and tapped a �� mounting hole at the rear of the tower, in between the shift rails. I smoothed the T-90 surface with a grinder. I also had to grind down one of the rails that protruded beyond the tower edge while in the rear position.� I can�t remember which, but it will be obvious if you try this.� I added some sealant and screwed the rear cap to the tower.� Some recommend that you should put a groove in the rails or case so oil can flow back, but I didn�t do this.� My ports were probably sloppy like yours.� The oil has enough room to flow back inward.� The result�no leaks from my shift tower, even after a few years have passed.� It�s an easy project.�
(http://www.mywillyspics.com/images/2017/10/04/IMG_1178.jpg)
(http://www.mywillyspics.com/images/2017/10/04/IMG_1176.jpg)