My Willys 3A and 3B Community
3A, 3B, DJ Technical Knowledge Base => "Original"-- Technical Questions, Answers, Observations => Topic started by: 1955CJ-5 on February 06, 2013, 08:29:19 PM
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Is a heat riser necessary? This manifold has the shaft but that is all that is left. I haven't really looked that hard yet but I see the springs are readily available.
Thanks,
randy
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Both on my two Lheads are stuck open. They run fine in the winter.
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They are designed to help with cold starts. Lot's of folks with working heat risers tie them into the open position with some wire. Especially during warm weather months. Does it have to work for good performance? No. Not really.
Mine was missing all the exterior stuff and was stuck open. I worked hard to get it working again. Mainly because I thought it was cool. To each his own on this one.
Tim
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Thanks....I'll put that way down near the bottom of the to-do list....bigger fish to fry right now....
Randy
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I too worked very hard to get mine unfroze and working again. It was very cool and worked great......for about a year when it froze up again. I have since unfroze it and wired it open....where it froze again.
Full disclosure...when I had my manifold tore apart I did not press the heat riser out and replace the bushings. If I did that my "fix" may have lasted a bit longer ::)
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I have had mine locked open since I bought the Jeep over two years ago with no problems at all.
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I worked hard to get it working again. �Mainly because I thought it was cool. � To each his own on this one.
Tim
I agree with Tim on this one. After a couple of years Carl and I were chasing a rattle and wired my heat riser in the open position and it's still that way.
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Mine too is wired open. I think they are suppose to be wired open! JamesR
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Probably a Tech Bulletin that we missed......!
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Ya'll can beat me up if you want to, BUT. A properly functioning Heat Riser Valve will contribute to decreased warm up time, and increased efficiencies in the motor with regards to fuel consumption and greater longevity of the motor overall. When the valve is closed at start-up the condensation that has built up in the crankcase is exhausted through the tail pipe and not sucked back into the cylinders. Don't know about ya'll but I find motor rebuilds to be expensive. Let the beating commence.
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Ya'll can beat me up if you want to, BUT. A properly functioning Heat Riser Valve will contribute to decreased warm up time, and increased efficiencies in the motor with regards to fuel consumption and greater longevity of the motor overall. When the valve is closed at start-up the condensation that has built up in the crankcase is exhausted through the tail pipe and not sucked back into the cylinders. Don't know about ya'll but I find motor rebuilds to be expensive. Let the beating commence.
Not saying you are wrong, Scout....In fact I agree with ya. How does the heat riser make crankcase condensation go out the tailpipe? Or are you saying the added heat of a faster warm up evaporates the condensation , which is sucked thru the PCV system and into the cylinders where it gets exhausted out the tail pipe?
From how I understand it the heat riser only warms up the intake manifold around the carb base, vaporizing cold fuel a bit better than if it were not operating. Once the engine fully warms up it opens so as to not get too much heat in the carb base and create vapor lock.
In any case faster warmups in cold weather means less engine wear, and ya can't beat that with a stick. :D I am somewhat surprised that Nate doesn't experience cold weather issues wth a blocked open riser, as it does get pretty darn cold up there.
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My apologies. I had the starting valve position backwards. It is open. Being open, it does allow faster warmup and quicker drying and expulsion of the condensate. As the manifold heats up, obviously the valve closes and redirects the heat and condensate out the tail pipe. With a valve that is stuck in the open position, the heat from the exhaust will create a too-hot condition in the fuel/air mixture causing inefficient fuel burn. The higher temps also allow the post-shutdown development of condensate in the manifold, which is why a poorly maintained motor will have an intake manifold that is black inside, and in the crankcase and that condensate will rise with the warm air from the crankcase into the PCV valve after shutdown and leave deposits which help in the accumulation of sludge in the PCV Valve, eventually blocking it and causing ever increasing crankcase pressure in the motor, overall poorer performance, oil blowing out of the fill tube, eventually, and causing seal failures and their concomitant leaks, and leads inevitably to a shorter life-span for the internal components of the motor. And stop and think for moment. Why does oil turn black? Because it accumulates carbon soot and dirt, which are particulate matter and moisture loves particulate matter. Cleaner oil for a longer period of time keeps a motor healthy. I require that the Heat Riser and PCV Valves be functioning correctly for all my carb work to be guaranteed.
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Thanks for the explanation, Scoutpilot!
No apology needed either. All is cool! I was asking because I was pretty confused myself...lol. Now I have to go out to the shop and actually look at the heat riser again ..I'm one of those learning by seeing guys (and forget by next morning...lol). 8-)
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Ain't nothing but a thing my friend. I too suffer temporary lapses. What was I talking about? OH, yeah. One other thing. A Heat Riser axle /pin that is loose in manifold is an ever-building exhaust leak. Heck of a thing if you drive with a full top in the winter.
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Dang Scoutpilot!! �I had to check my shorts. �You scared the C%$^p right outta me!! ;) �In all honestly, thank you for the information. �
Kinda makes me glad I have a working heat riser system.
Tim
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Thanks scoutpilot,
As I said in an earlier response on this thread, I had a working heat risor and just wired it open to chase a rattle. Left it wired open. After your great explanation it'll be un-wired next time I drive my Jeep. Since I got it working properly during the restoration it might as well be free to do what it was made to do. Thanks again.
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So it seems the worm has turned, and the heat riser is a good thing that should be operational. I see Walcks carries all the parts except the flap..is the flap made of something besides plain steel?
Anyone have one that they can take a picture of over a grid (cutting board)of some kind so I can make one?
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I am sending a photo of a heat riser critter that came on my replacement L 134. It is manual and I'm thinking you have to get out and change the setting as it warms up. The flap wasn't stuck and works fine. I don't see any way to put the bi-metal spring on it. Seems pretty labor intensive to me. It has an arrow on the arm with the word, ON.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u424/macgraham/P2240018_zpsa110d193.jpg)
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That setup may be for an industrial motor. I'll take some pics tomorrow and post them, unless someone beats me to it.
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The following two photos show the correct orientation for the heat riser valve in the open position.
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#1 Notice the orientation of the slot in the axle. It is aligned at 10 and 4 o'clock. The spring slides into the slot and is tightened with the arm to the shaft. Note also the spring tab and its position on the manifold.
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#2 The fully open position. Notice the spring rests on top of the tab which mounts to the left-lower manifold to manifold bolt. To re-bush the valve requires grinding the spot welds that hold the valve on the axle and driving the axle and old bushings out.
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Spot welds holding valve to axle. Inspect the valve closely. the welds are in the middle, so start there and keep working out until you find the inside edges of the flapper.