My Willys 3A and 3B Community

3A, 3B, DJ Technical Knowledge Base => "Original"-- Technical Questions, Answers, Observations => Topic started by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 04:43:22 PM

Title: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 04:43:22 PM: Hello,

I was just curious as to what anyone thought about the frame on this jeep.

The driver's side motor mount, and the boxed area behind it, are pretty bent up. ï¿½The motor mounts didn't bind at all when I removed the engine.

There are big hammer? dents on the outside of the frame which look like someone tried to hammer it back "close enough"......

So, what's the MINIMUM a guy would want to do to make it safe. ï¿½I'm fine with the way it looks, and like I say, the motor mounts didn't seem to be an issue. ï¿½This Jeep will never see the freeway, and I don't ever expect to have it in 4wd other than some back roads around here that my 2wd 4Runner has no problem with. ï¿½I'm not expecting a great, or even good driving vehicle. ï¿½It is what it is, and I just want it for groceries, and Sunday drives. ï¿½It's that "safety" part about it I'm most worried about!!!!

Thanks for any info!
Josh

(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_12-03-58_554.jpg)

(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_12-03-14_992.jpg)

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Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: F Bill on February 07, 2013, 05:08:21 PM: Josh would it be possible to get a picture from above of the front 5 or 6 feet of teh frame showing BOTH frame rails at once? I have a feeling you have a swayed frame that someone did a poor repair to, besides the bent up frame horn where the spring bracket is....

Honestly the easiest fix would be a new frame....yours is pretty mangled. Or you are going to need to purchase a large portopower kit and an acetylene torch to heat things up as you bend them back straight. Probably the first thing you might do is find an old copy of a 70's auto body book that inclused setup diagrams for frame straightening. You have a mix of sidesway and some mash possibly.... An old time frame shop might beable to fix it to acceptable levels.

Did you happen to notice before you took the jeep apart if the rear axle traveled in the tire tracks of the front axle? I have a feeling when this damage occurred the axles were probably over an inch out of line with each other before someone played King Kong with a big hammer.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 05:33:49 PM: It definitely appears that both frame rails got tweaked somehow, and I imagine at the same time. ï¿½It also makes sense why the Jeep was painted, and why the fenders are in really good shape.

I called an auto body shop that's right down the road from me, and asked him what his rates were, and he said it would be $100 to hook it up to the rig, or whatever it is they use, and another $40 per hour until it's good. ï¿½I asked him what an extreme case would be, and he said 10 hours would be pretty bad, maybe 5 would be average, whatever that means.

I'm guessing it looked like a crab when it rolled, but I never really was paying attention, and I only towed it home less than a mile from where I bought it from.

I couldn't agree more! ï¿½A new frame sounds great!........................ ï¿½no budget for that, for sure, hahaha. ï¿½I do have an Oxy setup that I've never used before, and a big hammer....................

I'm losing motivation by the second to keep scraping crud......................... ï¿½:(

All things considered, I can't complain.

Does the frame repair shop sound reasonable? ï¿½Assuming it's $500 or less.

and thanks for the quick reply!

(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_15-17-15_344.jpg)

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(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_15-14-08_59.jpg)
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: F Bill on February 07, 2013, 05:42:40 PM: Those rates sound very reasonable, It would be worth putting the tires back on, and dragging it over there once you steam clean all the crud off. I think you will need to pull the steering column off once it gets there, and everything you have out of the way for them will help keep the costs down. If they are confident about fixing it, I would let them, and have them reweld that crossmemeber while they are at it.

I wasn't suggesting a NEW fame , just one new to you. The 3A frame is one of th ebest flatfender frames out there, and occcasionally you can find someone parting out a 3a project that still has a decent frame.

Is that your son looking on in the one picture with that "WHAT DID THEY DO TO MY JEEP" expression on his face?
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 05:56:45 PM: Ah heck! (popular slang, here in Utah)

Okay, I'll have to set something up for him to come look at it here. He's a neighbor, so I'm hoping he'll drop by to give me an estimate if he can. I was surprised how cheap it sounded too.

I was just kidding about the new frame too. There is a 48 willy's 2a for sale in craigslist here for sale in pieces for $1,200 right now...... ;D I'd better not go look at it......oh, and you said the 3a's was better anyway.

That picture (I think the one you're referring to) is of me. Nice to meet you. haha I am a little kid, though I have none.

I'll post back up what happens next, as soon as I find out what he says.

Thanks again for the rapid replies.
Josh.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: garage gnome on February 07, 2013, 07:14:48 PM: The engine mount looks fine. But the rest of the frame rail is a whole different story...
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Macgraham on February 07, 2013, 07:26:46 PM: i've seen frames for sale in the 200 to 350 range but they should probably be checked on a frame machine too. Took my bare frame in and it cost 200 bucks to bring it back to the measurements in the manual. You'd be surprised how well everything fit on the rebuild.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Macgraham on February 07, 2013, 09:11:56 PM: There is a free frame in the For Sale section.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: F Bill on February 07, 2013, 09:30:38 PM: Quote
There is a free frame in the For Sale section.

Tried to find it, only frame I saw was a plow frame that is gone and CC's project which I beleive is long gone...

Or am I blind?
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 10:34:59 PM: Here are some more pictures from today when I rolled it out to clean the garage. ï¿½It turns out that a neighbor might have a connection to a "frame guy". ï¿½He's a car painter for the local Buick dealership, so I'm hopeful there might be some kind of discount if he's referring to his own shop, but he wasn't specific. ï¿½I'll post when I decide what I'm going to do. ï¿½

I'm really hopeful that a new frame isn't going to be necessary, but it looks pretty bad in these shots.

(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_16-41-58_203.jpg)

(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_16-41-32_692.jpg)

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(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr348/joshinpollock/2013-02-07_16-40-14_79.jpg)

Oh, I searched for the free frame, but didn't see it either. ï¿½Thanks for letting me know, though. ï¿½ I'll keep looking in craigslist too.

I guess I'll start looking into the stuck valve issue on the engine in the meantime.......! hahaha
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Macgraham on February 07, 2013, 10:56:37 PM: The frame is on page 2 of For Sale. It says free frame and axles. I just looked at it.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 07, 2013, 11:07:11 PM: Ohhh, I see it now. Gas/shipping would be a deal breaker for me. It's also a year old, but it could still be available.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Bob W on February 08, 2013, 05:59:20 PM: Here is a frame for sale over on The CJ-3B Page Bulletin Board, Dispatcher section.

http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/index.php?showtopic=4703

I have a real nice DJ3A frame for sale. Dirty with just a little surface rust here and there if I can remember correctly. The DJ was converted to 4WD but that should not matter.
Excellent condition frame.
$150
Located in Orange VA zip 22567
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: F Bill on February 08, 2013, 07:28:41 PM: I was going to post that, thanks for putting it up, Bob. Main difference will be the lack of the diagonal bracing and drawbar parts. Engine mounts are the same, front bumper and spring brackets are all the same.

Too bad it is a little too large for Greyhound. MAYBE you could get Fastenal to ship it if it is stripped and clean.
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Stack_O_Lee on February 08, 2013, 07:49:04 PM: Wow! Thanks you guys.

I'm not quite sure what I'm going to do with the frame I have yet. I'm hoping that the frame I have is salvageable (within a reasonable $$ amount).

As soon as I find out what the body guys say, I'll have a much better idea of where I'm headed with this.
and nice to know that the frames are a bit interchangeable, good to know.

Thanks again,
Josh
Title: Re: Bent frame rails on 1950 3a
Post by: Comanche_County on February 18, 2013, 10:44:24 AM: Quote
Quote
There is a free frame in the For Sale section.

Tried to find it, only frame I saw was a plow frame that is gone and CC's project which I beleive is long gone...

Or am I blind?

The CJ is in the garage, just haven't been able to get to it lately. That's about to change. I used a hi-lift and wedged it between some trees and cranked on the frame rails with a come along till I got it almost straight. I would have taken it to a frame shop up in the metroplex but didn't have the money at the time.