My Willys 3A and 3B Community
Your Projects => Your CJ-3A Project => Your Modified 3A Project => Topic started by: corpsman on February 08, 2015, 03:42:04 PM
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I just started the restoration of my 1950 cj-3a finally after owning it for 8 or 9 years.� it will be a complete restoration down to the bare frame.� I plan on keeping it mostly stock, but I will be installing a 2.4 liter Kubota turbo Diesel.� I will also add some things to strengthen it a bit, and I will be installing lock-right lockers in the diffs.� so far, I plan to leave the stock T-90 transmission, but I would like to swap it for a T-98 4 speed, if it will fit the Kubota adapter plate, and if I don't have to make to many modifications to make it fit the jeep.� info and tips are always appreciated.
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work in progress...
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more pics
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and more...
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Nice pics.
T98 is rare. You might be more lucky with a T18.
We have a post here about the Kubota swap.
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Nice pics.
T98 is rare. You might be more lucky with a T18.
We have a post here about the Kubota swap.
I may have mis-spoken. mine might have a T-18. I'm not sure. it has whatever came with the stock cj-3a in 1950. whatever it is, it's a 3-speed. I was thinking it would be good to have a 4-speed since I'm going with the Kubota. assuming I could find a 4-speed that will mate up to the adapter plate and the transfer case with no problems. thanks for letting me know, but I did check out the thread about the Kubota diesel. it had some good info, and that is exactly what I'm planning on doing.
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Your tranny is a T90 and the transferase is a Dana 18. A T18 is a heavy duty 4 speed and the T98 is an older version of the T18.
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Your tranny is a T90 and the transferase is a Dana 18. A T18 is a heavy duty 4 speed and the T98 is an older version of the T18.
thanks a bunch for the info. I was looking a few minutes ago, and I did see the model on the side of the transmission. (T90, like you said) so, would the T18 be a direct replacement? If not, does it lend itself to an easy swap? I would love to have a more heavy duty transmission with that extra gear.
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didn't have time to do a lot today. I removed the linkage and cable for the throw out bearing. I removed the linkage and arms for the clutch and brake. I removed the brake master cylinder. removed the steering box and the arm from the box to the pitman arm. also removed the rear driveshaft. there might have been another thing or 2, but nothing major.
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Your tranny is a T90 and the transferase is a Dana 18. A T18 is a heavy duty 4 speed and the T98 is an older version of the T18.
thanks a bunch for the info.� I was looking a few minutes ago, and I did see the model on the side of the transmission. (T90, like you said)� so, would the T18 be a direct replacement?� If not, does it lend itself to an easy swap?� I would love to have a more heavy duty transmission with that extra gear.
No. You will have to find a T98 from a CJ5 with a 4cyl with all the factory adaptors and driveshafts. That is a direct bolt in, but they are pretty hard to find.
If you can't find a T98, keep an eye out for a T15. They are the strongest of the 3 speeds. They were used in 72-75 CJ5s.
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You can find a T98 into some M38A1 also. It was also used in some ford and IH scout.
Check those sites for more info about adaptor:
http://www.advanceadapters.com/tech-vault/jeep-t98/
http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/t98.htm
My CJ-5 perkins diesel jeep came with a T98. I think it was an option but I'm not sure.
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I found the original post about kubota swap. They are using the T90.
http://www.cj3apage.com/cgi-bin/3Ayabb26/YaBB.pl?num=1364319832/0#0
The one pictured in their ads has an overdrive.
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The ones in the IH and fords will have a longer input shaft. That's why you need to use one from a CJ5 with a 4cyl.
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It's much easier to stay with the T-90 and add an overdrive. Then you can go with low ratio axles - 5.38 - and end up with a decent crawl ratio and still run at fairly good road speeds without running the RPM to high.
The only thing you don't get is a true "granny" low.
Another advantage of that solution is that you now effectively have a close ratio 6-speed because you can use the overdrive in any of the three gears and even reverse. I would assume that many gears would go nicely with a diesel.
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thanks for all the great info, guys.� now I'm really interested in an over-drive.� I can answer just about any question about a Suzuki samurai, but I'm new to this cj game.� can anyone give me any info on what I need to do to add an over drive.� how is this accomplished? I'm assuming the over drive unit shown in their advertisement, is the new looking thing bolted onto the back of the transfer case just behind the transmission??� sorry for the ignorance on the subject.
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Herm is the overdrive guy!
http://hermtheoverdriveguy.com
You can also check the our website. Jonathan did put a lot of great info about it;
Here is about the installation ;
http://www.cj3apage.com/index/My_1950/installing_an_overdrive.htm
Enjoy!
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Herm is the overdrive guy!
http://hermtheoverdriveguy.com
You can also check the our website. Jonathan did put a lot of great info about it;
Here is about the installation ;
http://www.cj3apage.com/index/My_1950/installing_an_overdrive.htm
Enjoy!
thanks for the link. that guy has a great page. I definitely plan on getting one of those over-drive units. i'll probably end up getting some other stuff. I'm sure my transmission and transfer case need to be rebuilt. anyway, thanks again for the info!
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made some progress today after work.� removed engine/tranny/transfer case, front driveshaft, shocks, brake lines, cross member, front weight, and a bunch of other crap.� the only thing left to do before the frame is bare, is unbolt the springs and roll the diffs out as a unit.�
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front and rear springs disconnected, diffs out, ready to be blasted with crushed glass.
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I bought some seats for the jeep the other day. they came out of a 90's mazda Miata. got both for $45.
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ready to be blasted. I figured I would clean it up pretty good so hopefully, the guys at the blasting place would have more time to do a better job. I was pretty surprised at how well the wire cup from harbor freight worked.
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You stripped that fast!
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You stripped that fast!
thanks! it was a lot of work, but I just keep thinking about how it will look once I am finished. of course it's a little early to say this, but I'm having so much fun, I may have to do another one when I finish this one. I suppose the floor on the body will slow my roll quite a bit.
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I'm probably a tad further along in my project than you, and I am already thinking about the next one. Apparently these things multiply on you pretty fast�
Nice Job!
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thanks! I'm the same way... already thinking about the next one.
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here's a copy of a picture of Eddy Arnold sitting in the jeep that I currently own featured in this thread. copy didn't turn out too good, but the license plate is dated 1952.
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That's a great old photo.
Your frame looks to be in very nice condition.
Your tub... Well, I've seen guys here fix stuff that was way worse.
Looks like a fun project to follow.
Tim
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Great picture!
And the side step is already bent!
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And the side step is already bent!
I saw that! I also noticed the banged up license plate. A common complaint from many of us�60 years later.
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yeah, that side step is just asking to get bang up on some rocks or logs. the side steps were ditched sometime before the jeep became mine. it's okay, because I wouldn't have used them anyway. yeah, the frame doesn't look bad at all. I spent a lot of time cleaning it so the guys at the blast place could have time to do a better job instead of dealing with all that mud and grease. the tub is pretty bad underneath, but yes, I've seen guys on here tackle much worse. it will go slow, but I can do it. thanks for the compliments on the picture. I thought it was pretty neat also.
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I really like old pictures like that....you can see that the "Willys" on the hood is painted, perhaps wheel color. And the rear hub is the same color as the wheel.....long arm on the rear view mirror, and there doesn't appear to be an inside mirror...pretty neat
And it looks like Eddy really used the jeep..cool
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thanks! yeah, I think it's just plain cool to have that pic. I wish I had more old ones like that of the jeep. the mirror is still on it. you can definitely tell he used his jeep.
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Old photos like that are great!!!
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�And the rear hub is the same color as the wheel.�
The studs and nuts look to be the same color too. Is it possible the rear wheel is just covered in wet mud?
The pin striping isn�t showing as clear as the front wheel striping.
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yeah, I didn't even notice the pin striping. I'm thinking that might be dust and dried mud.
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sorry, guys. nothing to report as of lately. we're still having crummy weather here in Tennessee. I'm hoping to do a little something this weekend. I think I'm beginning to have Jeep Withdrawal. :D :-/
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Yeah,� crummy weather all around.� � :(� �definately slowing project progress.
I just now noticed this thread,� including the post with old photo of Eddie Arnold.� (great photo!)� . .� �It has me puzzled though - >� in the recent "factory tire" thread,� Ryan posted some photos of a NDT style tire as original,� but this 1952 photo (although blurry) appears to be a more "civilian" type tread?
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i don't know.� the Jeep would have been 2 years old at that point.� maybe he put some different tires on it. hard for me to tell, but it looks like mis-matched tires to me. the front looks like a military non-directional. the rear looks like some sort of civilian mud terrain tire.
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the temperature finally rose enough to get out in the shop and do a little work on the jeep. didn't do much, but I managed to get the rear axle clean enough to begin disassembly. I had to stop there because I want to determine if the axles are threaded differently like the lug studs before I attempt to remove the axle nuts. seems like they are way too tight, but I don't have any experience with a "stick" axle. all of my previous experience is with "flange" axles. (Toyota and Samurai)
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One side is left hand thread. Look on the end of the studs. One side will have an L stamped on them. You need a special tool to bull the hub off the rear axles.
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I know the lug studs are stamped on the end, but I'm wondering if the axle threads are the same way.� do you really need the tool, or is there another way to remove the hub? also, I found a side cut-a-way view of the rear hub and axle. i guess the axle nut was tight because the axle is tapered. all that seems like a weird set up to me.
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Do you have a 3A service manual? If not, you may want to pick one up - you'll be glad you did. The diagrams and instructions are very helpful for stuff like this. You can also sign up at http://willysmjeeps.com and gain access to a large collection of M38 manuals - much of which applies to the 3A.
I think the chances of damaging something trying to remove the drum without an appropriate puller wouldn't be worth the risk. You are probably aware of how they work but here's a good video from Walck's showing how it's done.
[media]http://youtu.be/PQQvFK4B6pY[/media]
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I know the lug studs are stamped on the end, but I'm wondering if the axle threads are the same way.� do you really need the tool, or is there another way to remove the hub?� also, I found a side cut-a-way view of the rear hub and axle.� i guess the axle nut was tight because the axle is tapered.� all that seems like a weird set up to me.
Both axle shaft nuts are RH thread. A lot of old vehicles had axles that were two piece like that. Just a common thing in 1930-1940 vehicles at the time.
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Do you have a 3A service manual?
the only service manual I have, is the one that probably came with the jeep when bought new.� it's definitely not the greatest.� yeah, I should probably think about picking one up.� thanks for the link and video.
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Both axle shaft nuts are RH thread.
thanks!
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due to cold and snowy weather, I haven't been able to do much lately. so, finally today I was able to get out to the shop and make a little progress. I pulled both rear hubs, drums, axles, and all associated parts. I'm trying to let as much of the goo drain out of the diff as possible. the next order of business will be to pull all of the components out of the differential.
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Nothing better than diff nasties!
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Nothing better than diff nasties!
it's the best... (in a Nacho Libre' accent) ;)
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today's progress...� removed everything from rear diff...� carrier, ring gear, pinion, side gears, spider gears, bearings, seals, shims, races, etc...� rear diff is now completely bare. I found it strange that I found no traces of black paint on the rear axle housing. the only paint I found was a light green on top, and a darker O.D. green underneath. I'm wondering if that axle was replaced at some point with one from an M38??
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Looks good. What's your plan here? Are you just cleaning everything up and bolting back together or are you replacing some of the differential innards? These things can be a real challenge to reassemble correctly.
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Looks good. What's your plan here? Are you just cleaning everything up and bolting back together or are you replacing some of the differential innards? These things can be a real challenge to reassemble correctly.
all the gears look good, but I will inspect them closer just to be sure.� so, I will be replacing all the bearings, races, shims, and seals.� before I do that, I will completely clean the thing, prime and paint. I labeled all parts meticulously, took lots of pictures, and so fourth. since I'm keeping the ring gear and pinion, I'm thinking I can duplicate the shim situation and it should be good. of course I will check everything before it's buttoned back up. hopefully, I won't have too much trouble putting everything back together properly.
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I would leave the carrier bearings and pinion bearings alone. They are not the easiest things to replace.
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I'm wondering if that axle was replaced at some point with one from an M38??
An M-38 axle will have small valves in the grease relief ports at each wheel bearing while a CJ-3A axle just has a drilled hole.
There is a date stamped on the ring gear and on the right axle tube. These dates can be compared to the dates of other components on your Jeep to give clues about the originality of the parts.
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I've been down a similar path with my 3A rear axle. This is anything but a "How-to" guide but if you read what I did you no doubt pick up on a few things NOT to do. It starts here a meanders on for several pages:
http://www.cj3apage.com/cgi-bin/3Ayabb26/YaBB.pl?num=1390776835/15
And here's what BobW was referring to for a grease relief port on an M38 axle. I don't think yours has those but tough to tell from your pic.
(http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z403/rmurdock2121/1952%20M38%20SN%2056849/20141127_173626_zps285d0c91.jpg)
(http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z403/rmurdock2121/1952%20M38%20SN%2056849/20141127_173458_zps4f484687.jpg)
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I would leave the carrier bearings and pinion bearings alone. They are not the easiest things to replace.
just out of curiosity, what is it that makes the carrier bearings and pinion bearings so hard to replace?
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I'm wondering if that axle was replaced at some point with one from an M38??
An M-38 axle will have small valves in the grease relief ports at each wheel bearing while a CJ-3A axle just has a drilled hole.
There is a date stamped on the ring gear and on the right axle tube. These dates can be compared to the dates of other components on your Jeep to give clues about the originality of the parts.
yes, mine has the relief valves. in the last pic, I had already removed them. hmmm... interesting that it has an M38 rear end. even more interesting that I picked up on it before really knowing what to look for. (not to pat myself on the back or anything! lol!) thanks for the info!
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hmmm...� interesting that it has an M38 rear end.
The original one likely sustained damage and the owner figured it was easier to swap out with an M38 rear end he was able to scrounge up as opposed to rebuilding the broken one.
You will likely agree with that logic by the time you are done rebuilding it. I know I do� � :D
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hmmm...� interesting that it has an M38 rear end.
The original one likely sustained damage and the owner figured it was easier to swap out with an M38 rear end he was able to scrounge up as opposed to rebuilding the broken one.
You will likely agree with that logic by the time you are done rebuilding it. I know I do� � :D
I don't doubt that... :-/
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If you do end up rebuilding the thing completely you will need set-up bearings. This either requires buying a special set of tooling or a perfectly new set of bearings and reaming them out so they will slide off an on while you get the shim pack just right.
It's an expensive sacrifice of perfectly good bearings that will be useless to you otherwise. I have the set I made and would gladly loan them to you if need be. However,� I'd try and stick with GarageGnome's suggestion of NOT changing the carrier bearings if they appear to be in good shape.
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If you do end up rebuilding the thing completely you will need set-up bearings. This either requires buying a special set of tooling or a perfectly new set of bearings and reaming them out so they will slide off an on while you get the shim pack just right.
It's an expensive sacrifice of perfectly good bearings that will be useless to you otherwise. I have the set I made and would gladly loan them to you if need be. However,� I'd try and stick with GarageGnome's suggestion of NOT changing the carrier bearings if they appear to be in good shape.
thanks for the info. I will definitely take that into great consideration. I need to inspect them further, but they seem to be in pretty good shape. that being said. it's very possible, I might just follow the advice of you two guys. also, I really appreciate you offering to let me borrow your set-up bearings. that's awful nice of you. of course, if I leave the current ones in there I won't need them, but it's a nice gesture anyway.
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cleaned the rear axle/diff housing this evening. talk about tedious! I dread doing the front. anyway, after one last wipe down, it will be ready for primer.
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sorry, guys. nothing to report lately. I've been too busy at work. hopefully, i'll be able to get back on it in a couple of days. :'(
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sorry, guys.� nothing to report lately.� I've been too busy at work.� hopefully, i'll be able to get back on it in a couple of days. :'(
+1 . . . work interferes too much with important things - - > Jeep progress. >:(
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Work..... Good place to order the parts you need for the weekend.
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ha! yeah, i'll have to agree with both of you!
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just sold my front weight for using rear implements. cha-ching! more $$$ for parts!
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finally took the frame to the blasting place today. I should get it back sometime around the first of next week. then I've got some welding to do. as I was loading it up, I noticed a hairline crack in the front cross member close to the steering bracket. (sorry, I didn't take a pic) I've also got a few other places I need to repair, and/or make stronger. i'll try to post a pic or 2 when I get it back from being blasted.
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we finally had a sunny day, soI picked up the frame from the blasting place. it wasn't perfect, but it was pretty decent. it ended up costing $245.� here are some pics for anyone who might be interested...
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Looks good! Get those cracks fixed and some primer/paint on that frame ASAP! A freshly painted frame is a milestone moment on your rebuild. It usually means you are finished with the teardown phase and can finally start bolting on parts.. ;)
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Looks good!� Get those cracks fixed and some primer/paint on that frame ASAP!� A freshly painted frame is a milestone moment on your rebuild.� It usually means you are finished with the teardown phase and can finally start bolting on parts.. ;)
thanks! yes, I'm out of mig wire, so as soon as I get some, I will get it welded up and shoot it with some primer. i'll be glad to start being able to put some stuff back together, rather than just tearing down. although, I haven't torn the front diff apart yet, because I want to get the rear end back together before I do that.
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Photo frame6 makes me cringe. ;D
I liked macrisel's comment - > that now you have reached the point of putting it back together. :)
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ha! yeah, whoever "welded" that must have been high on something. it took almost a whole grinding wheel to get rid of that mess!
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I said that I was out of mig wire, so I thought I would explain what actually happened... I started to weld some cracks in the frame, and I just couldn't seem to get the welder set right. nothing I did seemed to help. I knew something wasn't right, and then I remembered that I had not checked the wire since I bought my new welder. (it was used, but looked brand new... the guy said his company bought it, and that it ended up not being big enough for their needs) so, I took the wire off and looked and saw "made in china" on the spool. no wonder it was welding so crappy. I have actually ran into that before. that Chinese wire has impurities in the metal. (most people can't weld good enough to even notice.) so, the only way to get small diameter wire that's not made in china, is to special order it from the welding supply shop. it's supposed to be in Tuesday. hopefully, once I get the new wire, I can get back on the frame.
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nothing really new to report. I was a feeling a little guilty because I haven't done anything to the jeep lately, so after taking a look at the forum for a minute, I decided to go out to the shop for just a bit. (at 10:00 at night) so, needless to say, I couldn't do much. however, I did grind down one or 2 of those crappy welds that occurred when I had the Chinese wire in my machine. I also worked on the right rear spring hanger bracket a bit and got it back into the proper position for re-welding. sorry... no pics. just wasn't interesting enough. unfortunately, I've let some side projects eat into my jeep time. I've been doing some work on my warn 8274 winches. I've also been refurbishing some Harrington 1 ton chain hoists that I got. hopefully, I can make some real progress soon.
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I'm still alive, guys! I've just been swamped at work. will give an update whenever it occurs! :-/
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I'm still alive, guys!� I've just been swamped at work.� will give an update whenever it occurs! :-/
What happened?? :o
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well... I finally made it back. I took a long hiatus from the jeep. mainly because it's so hot down here in the summer, it's nearly impossible to work in the shop without AC. also, it's good to have a break every now and then. well... good and bad. unfortunately, you get out of your groove and forget how everything goes back together. :-/ anyway, I got out in the shop for a little while this evening and welded a little on the frame. I still haven't primed it, but to my surprise, there are only a few little rust spots on it, and I can easily get rid of them with the wire wheel. so, doing that and priming will be my next task. not sure when i'll be able to do it. we went about 2 weeks without a drop of rain here, and now it hasn't stopped raining in a week or more. so, once I accomplish something meaningful, i'll post an update.
I'm still alive, guys!� I've just been swamped at work.� will give an update whenever it occurs! :-/
What happened??� �:o
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well...� finally something to update.� I primed and painted the frame today.� it went well, but it took a lot longer than I expected.� I used a 2 part epoxy primer that is supposed to be some really tough stuff, and it sprayed great and laid down really well.� I'm really pleased with the primer, even though it was pretty pricey.� as far as paint, I went with a single stage black with a satin finish.� It looks glossy in the pics because it was still wet.� it will take a day or 2, but the gloss will come out, and it will look nice.� I've used it before.� I was originally going to paint the jeep od green, but I have since changed my mind.� I just see too many of those, and I guess it just gets old.� I think I'm going to do a medium dark blue, (not as dark as navy) and I'm going to paint the wheels orange. (pretty close to a florida gators orange)� anyway, that's why I painted the frame black.� whatever the case, it feels good to accomplish something on it for a change.
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been wanting to get back on the project lately. I need to start ordering the parts for the rear end. it might take me a while to get all the parts. I'm having to save money for some trips me and the wife will be taking in the somewhat near future.
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Looks great, funny how these things take a back seat when life gets in the way. I know the feeling...