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Topic Summary

Posted by: aboyandhisdog
« on: June 10, 2015, 07:05:56 PM »

Sorry, don't know how to fill in FBill's blanks from the previous page, so hopefully anyone looking for this info. might find it here:


Quote
Also they used a 97 tooth flywheel and a ____tooth drive.
 

According to Walcks, the 4113 had a 9 or 10 tooth drive but both worked on the 97T ring gear.


Quote
Earliest 3A used MZ-4137   

It had a pushrod operated switch with the pushrod thru the floor 124 tooth flywheel ,_____tooth drive

The 4137 and the 4162 also had a 9T drive for the 124T ring gear.


Quote
This required a new 129 tooth ring gear, a different flywheel, flywheelhousing, rear engine plate, and the starter no longer uses a bushing in the bell, as it has a nose cone with a bushing installed in it. Starter drive uses ______teeth.

The 129T ring gear also used a 9T drive.


Also a note on these foot starters...The round starter button on the top of the switch will screw in.  This will allow you to delay the juice to the bendix until AFTER the lever has already engaged the ring gear.  Discovering this has been painful for me ($$ already spent on rebuilding starter, drives, ring gear r&r, etc).   You may need to unscrew it and clip off the bottom end of the spring in order to screw it in all the way, but you'll get there.  The problem I was having is the starter would get just up to the ring gear but would just screetch and spin without fully engaging and turning the flywheel.
Posted by: Mark W.
« on: December 26, 2014, 11:39:02 AM »

MY jeep (model number is irrelevant) Has a 1948 engine with the later bell housing (long bolt bosses enclosed starter cone made to fit the 9.25" clutch) and plate. The flywheel has 129 teeth. The starter is a key on/off dash mounted button with a fenderwell mounted solenoid. I am quite certain this was all done about 1963 when the engine was being rebuilt by my dad. 
Posted by: stony
« on: July 15, 2013, 11:25:30 AM »

IMHO that mechanical starter is by far the best design.  Had a 56 CJ5 that we managed to bury in clay mud up in Alaska.  Filled the bellhousing, and ever after that the starter would not engage properly.  Pull the starter, clean it and it would work for a week or two, then same problem.  With the mechanical starter there would never have been a problem.
Posted by: Bob W
« on: May 03, 2013, 07:57:20 PM »

Yes, you will need to get the regular switch that mounts to the top of the MZ 4137 ,the push rod, and return spring.
Posted by: Operation Overlord
« on: May 03, 2013, 05:34:54 PM »

So basically its still the MZ 4137 starter and what I need to do is get the mechanical linkage back in tact. I think that will solve my amperage problem as I feel the aftermarket solenoid is robbing the starter of amperage with the small cable on the far side of the solenoid.
Posted by: Bob W
« on: May 03, 2013, 05:52:12 AM »

I've seen those solenoid conversions before. No idea where you would get one of those solenoids if it failed. Probably a good old fashioned electrical repair shop would know.
Posted by: Operation Overlord
« on: May 03, 2013, 03:11:06 AM »

Sooo.....what kind of starter is this? �It's off of my early 49 3A with key start. �When I purchased it, it had a 12 volt battery. I have since converted it back to 6 volt but am experiencing slow cranking at times with a sort of grinding mechanical sound. �Other times it rotates normally. �Is this a Frankenstein? �It has no nose cone and the solenoid doesn't look like its mounted like that from the factory.
Posted by: garage gnome
« on: April 06, 2013, 10:43:12 PM »

Thanks Bill for the info.
Posted by: F Bill
« on: April 05, 2013, 11:04:05 AM »

Starter info and numbers:


MB used WO -A1245 � AUTOLITE MZ4113 and MZ 4311*      * �might be a typo in the book, number is goofy.

GPW used GPW11001, GPW 11001A, GPW 11002 and the Autolite numbers above.

Autolite �MZ4124 was 12 volt starter..


Cj2A used MZ4113 according to the maintenance manual.

All starters up to this point were operated with a pushbutton switch mounted underneath the floor that looks similar to a dimmer switch but is actually a large contact that �the pushbutton jumpers. �Also they used a 97 tooth flywheel and a ____tooth drive.


Earliest 3A used MZ-4137 � �It had a pushrod operated switch with the pushrod thru the floor 124 tooth flywheel ,_____tooth drive


At CJ3A 51911 it changed to MZ 4162 � With a different pushrod and lever. Still same flywheel as previous 3A models.

in 1952, at VIn number 452GB1 -30973 � it changed to MCH-6203 � with key start, solenoid mounted on starter.

This required a new 129 tooth ring gear, a different flywheel, flywheelhousing, rear engine plate, and the starter no longer uses a bushing in the bell, as it has a nose cone with a bushing installed in it. Starter drive uses ______teeth.



Anyone want to fill in the blanks with documentation?


All above courtesy Bob Westerman, Wes Knettle, Ryan Miller, and TM ORD9 SER G 503 , and Willys Maintenance manual 1945 edition.

Posted by: Quebec Jeep
« on: April 05, 2013, 08:28:42 AM »

You should get one! Now!
Posted by: garage gnome
« on: April 04, 2013, 09:02:31 PM »

I should probably get one of those books then... ::)
Posted by: Bob W
« on: April 04, 2013, 09:02:30 PM »

Key start became the standard. The firewall push-rod hole even went away.
Posted by: F Bill
« on: April 04, 2013, 08:59:45 PM »

My understanding is that all jeeps after a certain date were Key Start.  The key start starter is larger, has a nose cone, and used a different flywheel, engine plate,  and bellhousing. If I remember correctly what I read in Bob's book.
Posted by: garage gnome
« on: April 04, 2013, 08:32:50 PM »

So, was the key start an option or did the '53s just get it because thats the way they were?
Posted by: F Bill
« on: April 04, 2013, 07:43:16 PM »

Quote
We have some good starter information on our website here...
http://www.cj3apage.com/index/Tech_Tips/StartersAndRinggears.htm

The timeline for CJ-3A starters is a bit mixed up on that page. It should read....

Early MZ 4137
Mid � �MZ 4162
Late �MCH 6203


Hi Bob...This week I did a lot of sitting around at an Oilfield site, waiting for the roughnecks to dismantle the rigs so we could escort them to a new site. I had your book with me, which was a great way to pass the time, and started to look up all the parts differences over the years.. I will be posting some of the numbers you had listed there, with the serials  number breaks of you don't mind, in this thread. Hopefully we will get this all hammered out and be able to make sense of it all, then build a new thread with all the info in a nice clean form easy to read, and eventually correct the webpage mentioned.

Much thanks to Nate for taking this on.. and everyone who has contributed info over the years about it.

Bill